Ep 47 with Linda Jeng

Linda Jeng is a digital economy leader and strategist with over two decades of experience in FinTech, policy, and regulation. She is the founder & CEO of Digital Self Labs, a Washington D.C.-based Web3 advisory firm. Digital Self Labs is a cross-disciplinary advisory firm combining blockchain software expertise with policy and regulatory strategy. Linda helps clients design and implement innovative solutions that empower individuals and enable interoperability, transparency, and efficiency in the financial and digital sector.

She is also a renowned scholar and educator, with affiliations at Georgetown University Law Center, Duke University Law School, and the Bank for International Settlements. She conducts cutting-edge research and teaches courses on open banking, digital identity, and decentralized finance (DeFi). and has authored several publications and contributed to influential books on these topics. She is a frequent speaker and commentator in the media, and a Forbes contributor. Linda holds a J.D. from Columbia Law School and a master's degree in EU and International Law from Université Toulouse Capitole. She speaks Mandarin Chinese, French and basic German.

In this episode of Regulatory Ramblings, she talks to host Ajay Shamdasani about an op-ed piece she wrote which was published by Coindesk entitled “The Biggest Bank Heist in History Is Coming.”

The premise and the focus of the discussion is that regulators are permitting banks to tokenize financial assets such as bank deposits, U.S. Treasuries and corporate debt. Yet, they want institutions to use permissioned networks rather than the decentralized blockchains that keep assets safe from hackers.

As Linda stated in her article: “In February, the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency’s acting head Michael Hsu announced plans for new rules on operational resilience for large banks with critical operations, including third-party service providers. Critically, that wasn’t discussed, however, was that the rules would “treat the use of permissioned networks by the big banks to tokenize real world assets and liabilities, an omission that neglects critical new vulnerabilities for the global financial system.”

A key theme of the conversation is that encouraging the use of permissioned networks over permissionless blockchains will inevitably lead to cybersecurity attacks “on a scale previously unknown as the financial system moves to tokenize trillions of dollars’ worth of real world assets and liabilities. The biggest bank heist in history is in the making.”

“By contrast, most successful crypto hacks usually involve centralized protocols where hackers only need to hack the admin keys of only one or a few actors to gain control and steal digital assets. Similarly, permissioned networks are controlled by only a few parties, so they can be more easily hacked than blockchains maintained by thousands of validators. The concentration of attack vectors in the big banks that control these permissioned networks (or the central banks that control non-blockchain ledgers) is like sticking targets on their backs,” she said.

Linda goes on to discuss how she ended up in the legal profession, what drew her to digital assets as a scholar and why she believes the worst attacks against banks have yet to come.

HKU FinTech is the leading fintech research and education in Asia. Learn more at www.hkufintech.com.

Ep 46 with Daniel Greenberg

Daniel Greenberg is the founder, president, and lead investigator of Greenberg Corporate Intelligence, a Washington, DC-based boutique investigations firm that commenced operations in March 2023. The firm offers research and intelligence services for private-sector clients such as support attorneys, private equity firms, hedge funds, and compliance teams.

Dan has been working in the due diligence and corporate investigations field since 2010. Most recently, he was a managing director at Forward Risk, having previously worked at Kroll, Exiger and TD International.

Beginning in 2018, Dan helped grow Forward Risk from a small, newly established company with a handful of employees to a premier firm with over 25 full-time investigators. Forward Risk was acquired in November 2022, and, after a transition period, Dan left to establish his own independent firm – GCI.

He has a track record of uncovering hard-to-find facts, overcoming difficult challenges, and providing responsive service. His experience has mainly centered on investigative due diligence, shareholder activism support, litigation support, and competitive intelligence.

Dan holds a B.A. in International Affairs from George Washington University and an M.A. in Middle Eastern History from Tel Aviv University. Dan is also Certified Fraud Examiner (CFE #: 869765). Dan is licensed as a Private Detective in the District of Columbia.

The term due diligence is so often overused that in present colloquial vernacular, it is used as a quick, easy, and often lazy shorthand way of describing a plethora of background checks – varying from basic, perfunctory desk research to full blown investigations.

To tackle such misconceptions, Daniel chats with Regulatory Ramblings host Ajay Shamdasani to clarify what “due diligence” actually entails, while describing his own path as an entrepreneur.

Daniel shares his recollections about going to college in the US capital and later pursuing further graduate study - delving into the past of a long-troubled region in Israel.

The conversation goes on to delineate why investigative due diligence is (or should be) of paramount concern to the world’s largest banking and financial institutions and multinational corporations, as well as whether traditional backgrounds such as law enforcement, military service or intelligence work are necessarily the best ways to get into such work in an age when many corporate investigators are ex-journalists or researchers.

Daniel stresses that his firm’s approach to such work is focused on using open sources, public records, and interviews to identify and understand fraudulent behaviour and other risk issue.

The discussion concludes with a reflection on the tragic events following Hamas’ incursion into Israel on October 7, 2023, and Daniel shares his expertise on how, with all the intelligence and technology Israel had at its disposal, even it was taken by surprise.

HKU FinTech is the leading fintech research and education in Asia. Learn more at www.hkufintech.com.

Episode #45 with guest John B. Quinn, Quinn Emanuel Urquhart & Sullivan, LLP

John B. Quinn is the founder and chairman of the nearly four-decade old Los Angeles law firm Quinn Emanuel Urquhart & Sullivan. The firm has been voted the world’s "most-feared law firm" ten times by independent research provider BTI Consulting, which surveyed over 300 key legal decision-makers at the world’s largest organizations.

In fact, in BTI’s annual survey - when respondents were asked the law firm that they least wanted to face as opposing counsel – Quinn Emanuel is consistently ranked number one as the world’s most feared litigation law firm.

Since 1986, John and his partners have built the largest law firms in the world devoted solely to business litigation and arbitration – which The Wall Street Journal called a “global litigation powerhouse.” In that time, Quinn Emanuel has grown to 35 offices in 12 countries on four continents, with over 1100 lawyers, generating more than $2 billion in revenue annually. In recent years, the firm has recovered over $80 billion for plaintiffs.

John also has ties to Hollywood, where, for 33 years, he served as General Counsel to the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences, the organization behind the Oscars.

An avid mountain climber, Ironman triathlete and father of five, he is also the host of the popular podcast "Law, disrupted" - www.law-disrupted.fm.

In this episode of Regulatory Ramblings, he chats with host, Ajay Shamdasani, about how he found his way into the legal profession, his representation of the Bank of China, Alibaba, AliPay, and Ant Financial – juggernauts on the mainland Chinese banking and fintech / digital payments scene – as well as his belief in Singapore's importance as a dispute resolution centre for the Asia-Pacific. He also comments on how Hong Kong stacks up against the Lion City in that regard.

The conversation also covers the business rationale for Quinn Emanuel Urquhart’s focus on purely litigation and for not to representing the world’s largest money centre banks, notwithstanding the deep pockets for premium legal services that the world’s biggest financial institutions possess. It is an approach that has won the firm many plaudits amongst the plaintiffs’ bar writ large.

John also shares his candid thoughts on Environmental, Social and Governance (ESG) concerns at a time when such considerations in corporate operations and investing are under attack – often from prominent figures in the business world. He also comments on what can be done on the level of policy and legal reform to lure more foreign direct investment to the Middle East and Asia Pacific.

The discussion concludes with John commenting on his commitment to the arts and philanthropy and the importance of giving back to society when one attains a certain level of success – such as his longstanding service to the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences, opening the Museum of Broken Relationships in Los Angeles.

HKU FinTech is the leading fintech research and education in Asia. Learn more at www.hkufintech.com.

In this episode of Regulatory Ramblings, Ron Yu and Donald Day chat with host Ajay Shamdasani on the potentially pernicious consequences of non-technically trained lawyers - specifically, those without degrees or substantial experience in science, technology, engineering or math (STEM) - offering advice in situations where technology is either implicated or at the core of the matter. The law can be unforgiving to those that are ignorant of its often arcane ways and ultimately, it is clients that pay for what lawyers either do not know or assume, the guests share.

In an age of AI, machine learning and large language models (LLMs) – they do not go as far as to say lawyers need to learn how to code, but counsel need to understand the practical legal, business, financial and reputational implications of such technologies for their clients.

Technology can, at times, change the rules of the game, Ron and Donald stress. Yet, they also point out that sometimes lawyers suggest contractual terms that are legally feasible but based on current technology, impractical – such as the Bitcoin 10-second consensus period: a performance requirement that is not possible to do. As our guests explain, if there are terms in a contract that are unworkable, it could lead to a lawyer killing a deal either out of ignorance of the underlying technology or a lack of commercial acumen.

The discussion moves onto how rare it is to find those that are technically trained and also licensed, practicing lawyers. Clearly, the more technical a subject, the less likely an average dispute resolution practitioner at the typical multinational, Anglo-American law firm is going to be up to the task. Our guests acknowledge that leaves clients a very narrow field of specialists to choose from if they want to be represented by lawyers who both understand both the law and the underlying technology involved.

Lawyers often view technology through the lens of the legal and regulatory compliance implications, with less focus on the implementation of a particular technology. How it will work, and how and where best to use it is an afterthought. As for cybersecurity, it is regarded as an IT issue, they say. If a lawyer overlooks the cybersecurity issues, Yu said, then they are glossing over important technical details which can harm a client.

The conversation concludes on the point that when it comes to 'tech lawyers', it certainly seems that, generally speaking in APAC, those practitioners that market themselves well have the biggest platforms and the loudest voices and are, therefore, regarded as authorities in their respective fields.

Clearly. there are times where there is no substitute for the right kind of technical background. For example, as Donald Day recalls, patent litigators not infrequently have to deal with solicitors who don’t understand the tech and those solicitors soon become a hindrance.

Both guests underscore the lingering perception that it is not ideal to engage in IP-related litigation in Hong Kong because of the lack of talent; even if a specialist carefully explains something to a solicitor, the latter will invariably get it wrong or simply not understand the subject matter.

Ronald Yu is the director and co-founder at MakeBell Limited. He is also a visiting fellow at the City University of Hong Kong's (CityU's) School of Law and a part-time law lecturer at Peking University.

Donald Day is the chief operating officer of FinTech start-up firm VDX, which is building a digital asset eco-system for institutional investors.

HKU FinTech is the leading fintech research and education in Asia. Learn more at www.hkufintech.com.

Episode 43 with guest Jon Solorzano, Vinson & Elkins

Jon Solorzano is a Los Angeles-based attorney who serves as counsel and co-head of the environmental, social, and governance (ESG) task force at the law firm of Vinson & Elkins. Prior to this role, he served as senior director for legal and corporate development at the Clorox Company.

Beyond ESG, Jon is also a highly sought-after thought leader with significant expertise in related fields such as M&A, corporate governance, securities regulation, corporate and business development, consumer products, technology, human capital management, business financial strategy, and international matters for both high-growth start-ups and established Fortune 500 companies.

Few topics are as vexatious and polarizing in contemporary times as the acronym ESG. Legendary investors such as Warren Buffet and his second-in-command, the late Charlie Munger, along with other prominent corporate and finance figures, argue that ESG should not be a consideration in investment decisions.

Against this backdrop, Jon discusses with Regulatory Ramblings host Ajay Shamdasani why ESG matters to investors, companies, and society, alongside corporate social responsibility (CSR) and diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI). He stresses that while these concepts and movements are related and overlap to some degree, they are not necessarily the same thing. Indeed, Jon notes that those who coined the term ESG might have garnered more support for their cause had they emphasized (G)overnance rather than (E)nvironmental, as even skeptics of global warming can appreciate the importance of well-governed companies and how that affects share prices.

Jon also shares insights into his upbringing, background, and path into the legal profession, as well as how, as a transactional lawyer, he ended up leading his firm’s ESG practice.

While acknowledging the concerns of ESG detractors and naysayers, Jon predicts that 10-15 years from now, the nature of the debate and discussion will be very different. By then, few will even question the importance of ESG to the world’s well-being, he says, as millennials and Zoomers take over the reins of society in developed countries.

A telling sign that Jon's predictions are accurate is that for younger investors, ESG definitely matters as a yardstick in gauging what constitutes a socially conscious and sustainable investment.

The conversation concludes by examining the extent to which ESG mandates intersect with financial regulation, and why banking and financial institutions globally need to take ESG as seriously as their regulatory compliance and risk management requirements.

NOTE: All related links are in the #RegulatoryRamblings page at: https://www.hkufintech.com/regulatoryramblings

HKU FinTech is the leading fintech research and education in Asia. Learn more at www.hkufintech.com.

Episode 42 - Jonathan Crompton, Reynolds, Porter & Chamberlain

Jonathan Crompton is a Hong Kong-based partner at the law firm of Reynolds, Porter & Chamberlain (RPC) where he helps companies and individuals navigate complex cross-border disputes and investigations involving their Asian operations, specialising in commercial matters (in particular for the retail industry), financial services and technology related disputes and cyber incidents.

And as the lead for RPC’s 'ReSecure' cyber incident response service in Asia, he advises local and multinational clients on cyber-attacks, data privacy and law enforcement investigations, as well as helping clients across the globe to recover money transferred to Hong Kong bank accounts as a result of cyber and other frauds.

Jonathan advises on all forms of disputes including litigation before national courts and arbitral tribunals operating under various rules (in particular, the HKIAC, ICC and UNCITRAL), and on investigations by regulators (notably financial services regulators such as the Securities and Futures Commission). His clients include senior individuals, asset managers, and leading multi-national corporations and brands. As a result of RPC's predominantly 'conflict-free' model for financial services disputes, Jonathan represents senior individuals and companies in claims brought by or against leading banks where other firms are often unable to act.

He is also a founding member of the Hong Kong chapter of the Crypto Fraud and Asset Recovery (CFAAR) network, the first global association for such professionals. The London chapter was launched in London in 2021, with the Hong Kong chapter formed in August 2022.

In this episode of Regulatory Ramblings, Jonathan chats with host Ajay Shamdasani about his background, upbringing and how he ended up in the legal profession. The bulk of the conversation, however, is devoted to data protection and digital assets, specifically the February raid of the offices of WorldCoin by the Hong Kong Office of the Privacy Commissioner (PCPD). They discuss the PCPD’s expression of concern about WorldCoin's collection and storage of iris scans in exchange for its WorldCoin token (WLD).

As Jonathan points out, the case was a clear example of the increasing intersection of personal data protection principles and digital assets. The conversation also covers his recent LinkedIn post in which he stated that the Privacy Commissioner Ada Chung’s action was further proof that she was flexing her existing powers – even before the amendments to the territory’s Personal Data (Privacy) Ordinance are expected to be enacted within the next year.

They also discuss what shape Jonathan envisages those amendments taking, as well as what cases he has seen in his practice in recent times involving virtual assets, digital contracts and cybersecurity, as well as related emerging methodologies, trends and themes.

USEFUL LINKS

Jonathan Crompton on RPC page and on LinkedIn
CFAAR – About Us
PCPD warning on World Coin Project

New book - FinTech: Finance, Technology & Regulation
HKU-SCF Fintech Academy
Asia Global Institute
Professional Certificate in FinTech

HKU FinTech is the leading fintech research and education in Asia. Learn more at www.hkufintech.com.

Madhurima Mukherjee Saha
Partner, J Sagar Associates

Madhurima Mukherjee is the New Delhi-based head of the J Sagar Associates law firm’s capital markets division. She has over two decades of experience in securities offerings in both the domestic and international markets – including initial public offerings (IPOs), further offers, rights offers, qualified institutional placements and block trades.

Sometimes referred as India’s “queen of capital markets,” Madhurima has been part of some of the country’s highest profile capital raising efforts, including the 2010 Coal India IPO, which eventually raised over US$ 2.5 billion and remains one of India’s largest IPOs.

Prior to joining JSA, she was a Senior Partner at AZB & Partners until April 2020. She has also worked with Luthra & Luthra as a national head and partner until 2013 and before that, she was a partner at the firm of Amarchand & Mangaldas & Suresh A. Shroff & Co, as a partner until 2006.

Madhurima had taken credit courses and some seminars in Capital Markets at The West Bengal National University of Juridical Sciences and National Law School, New Delhi.

Given that India is currently in strong growth mode compared to much of the rest of the world, it’s no surprise that such an environment has birthed a budding start-up scene. Indeed, in the three-plus decades since the Indian economy liberalized, even more young entrepreneurs have arrived on the scene – many with dreams of becoming publicly listed companies via the IPO route. Yet, being a developing nation, myriad challenges remain for start-ups seeking public listings in India, which Madhurima delineates in her chat this episode with Regulatory Ramblings host Ajay Shamdasani.

She discusses how she found her way in the legal profession, her passion for working with startups and the challenges that they face in India beyond those of legal, regulatory, financial/liquidity and managerial issues. Madhurima stresses the challenges of getting and retaining talent, as well as the degree of governmental support – or the lack thereof – in the form of red tape, tax and support programs that Indian startups face.

The conversation concludes with her views on how the Securities Exchange Board of India (SEBI) – the country’s capital markets watchdog – can improve securities and listing rules to make it easier for the country’s startups to go public.

HKU FinTech is the leading fintech research and education in Asia. Learn more at www.hkufintech.com.

Ep 40 - Neha Mehta, Founder & CEO, FemTech Partners

Neha Mehta is a member of the department of mathematics at Nanyang Technological University in Singapore. She also teaches in that institution’s Master of Science program in FinTech.

Among her interests are financial inclusion using FinTech as a vehicle to achieve it, as well as climate sustainability, innovating for a blue economy and greener future, and encouraging more women to enter the tech space – evidenced by her work with the group SG Women In Tech.

Neha is also a FinTech lawyer, former diplomat, and social entrepreneur, in addition to being the author of a new book called “One Stop” on the topic of Super Apps.

As she points out new software applications are churned out every day to respond to meet people’s needs. “Super Apps,” she says, are apps that allow users to access several services from one single application. Super Apps like Grab and WeChat are gaining popularity and tech giants and FinTechs looking to stake their claim in this digital revolution. In “One Stop,” Neha traces the history of Super Apps and analyses the cultural differences in their adoption and popularity – and in some cases, the lack thereof – in the East versus the West. Through stories of well-known Super Apps and in-depth interviews with central banks, entrepreneurs, and FinTech industry experts, Neha’s book illustrates how the Super App revolution disrupts, innovates and creates opportunities.

With the COVID-19 pandemic as a background highlighting the need to move to digital platforms, “One Stop” also examines how Super Apps can potentially create an inclusive and sustainable world for all, in a future that looks increasingly digital.

With that as a launching pad, Neha shares with Regulatory Ramblings host Ajay Shamdasani about her upbringing in Bangalore, as well as how she first got interested in matters of financial inclusion, climate sustainability, the green economy and women in tech, and what she sees as the interconnections between them – namely, economic growth and good stewardship of the planet.

The discussion also delves into creating talent pools in the tech entrepreneur and/corporate realms with an eye towards seeing more women at the decision-making table in boardrooms. A key part of the equation, Neha says, is getting more females enrolled in STEM subjects earlier in life. In that vein, she stresses the need for policy frameworks incentivizing parents of young girls to send them to schools which are focused on how they can be software engineers, or enter the emergent fields of artificial intelligence or data management.

She goes on to share her views about the tech ecosystem and entrepreneurial environment in Singapore, drawing on her experiences. In 2019, Neha set up a company called FemTech Partners with the aim of representing women in tech – especially the fintech space. The focus was on how to make them financially resilient and receive the pro bono mentorship they need.

The conversation includes Neha’s thoughts on being a member of the math faculty at NTU, as well as summarizing the key conclusions, observations and policy recommendations of her book.

HKU FinTech is the leading fintech research and education in Asia. Learn more at www.hkufintech.com.