Episodios

  • Live Like You Mean It: Emotional and Cognitive Wellness, with Dr. Mary Helen Immordino-Yang

    Live Like You Mean It: Emotional and Cognitive Wellness, with Dr. Mary Helen Immordino-Yang
    Apr 28 2025
    Applying neuroscience and psychology to education and formation, pioneering researcher Dr. Mary Helen Immordino-Yang draws connections between emotions, relationships, brains, stories, meaning, and purpose to shed light on how we learn, grow, and thrive.Her research on the brain shows how we’re woven together in an intricate and glorious network of life, and when we synthesize the neurological, the psychological, the physical, and the social, we’re able to come to a deeper and more impactful understanding of human development and flourishing.From the intricacies of adolescent brain development to the emotional and spiritual scaffolding of a meaningful life, she explains how transcendent thinking, story, and emotional engagement fuel identity formation and long-term flourishing. Drawing from cutting-edge research and humanistic insight, she explores how young people co-create their worlds and how adults can support them in becoming adaptive, wise, and agentic.In this conversation with Mary Helen Immordino-Yang, we discuss:The value of integrating neuroscience with educational, emotional, and moral developmentThe strange and glorious case of the adolescent brain—how we mature, learn how to think, feel, and exercise our agency, and strive to become wiseThe emotional and relational nature of education and moral development—expressed in nurturing conversation between caring adults and youthThe importance of agency, intentionality, and transcendent thinking in human thrivingNeural plasticity and the capacity to change our brains throughout our lifespanAnd, the big picture of thriving, that brings together our mental life, neurobiology, and other physical processes—with relationships, community, and society at large.Episode Highlights"Thriving is really about living like you mean it.""We co-construct one another’s lived experiences by the virtue of being there together.""You learn how to have an instinct—it’s not something you’re just born with.""Transcendent thinking literally grows the adolescent brain.""Meaning-making is an abstraction, a transcendent story we construct to bring coherence to our lives."Show NotesThriving as dynamic, purposeful engagementEmotional experiences shaping brain developmentCo-construction of identity in social relationshipsAdolescence as a time of neurodevelopmental remodelingHow transcendent thinking fosters brain growth over timeAdolescents’ drive for deeper moral and ethical narrativesMeaning-making as a tool for personal and societal transformationLinking personal experience with historical and social narrativesDefault mode network and its role in reflection and creativityFrom instinct to insight—how the brain learns to feelThe relationship between emotional health and physical well-beingGut-brain connection, serotonin, and embodied cognitionTranscendence as a cognitive-emotional developmental milestoneInfluence of media, anxiety, and political division on adolescent mindsBrain-based evidence of narrative engagement growing identityLearning to align present feelings with long-term purposeBrain science dismantling the myth of "subjective = unimportant"Agency, presence, and intentionality in thrivingIntegration of neuroscience with humanistic and applied methodsRole of narrative in therapy, art, education, and spiritualityHow adolescents learn to feel, not just what to thinkCulturally-rooted belief systems shaping neural responsesThe importance of reflection, introspection, and deep conversationAdolescents’ innate capacity for moral concern and big-picture thinkingLearning through story: case studies in adolescent empathyReclaiming agency from external cultural and tech influencesIdentity as a lifelong, evolving narrative—not a fixed outcomeGrowth as intentional reflection, not cognitive accelerationSpiritual wellness as iterative construction of meaning and valuesParenting and mentoring for deep reflective growthAdaptive wisdom: balancing immediacy with long-term visionSigns of flourishing: self-liking, relationship quality, agencyImportance of diverse experiences and safe, supportive relationshipsAdults thriving through neuroplasticity and meaning-makingThe lifelong role of story and belief in shaping purposeCognitive engagement and values-based direction over passive successEmotional safety and time as prerequisites for transcendenceListening, asking why, and welcoming the unknown as virtues of thrivingPam King’s Key TakeawaysBrain science isn’t better or worse than other perspectives on human life, but it offers incredible insight for how we grow and thrive.Stories and narratives are the essential threads that hold our lives together; how you think and the story you’re telling yourself matters for your thriving.Education isn’t just a cognitive process. Our emotions and our bodies and our sense of connection and safety in relationships play a central role in learning.Spiritual health connects how our transcendent thinking informs our ...
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    1 h y 5 m
  • Living Artfully: Creativity, Attention, and Making Art, with Makoto Fujimura

    Living Artfully: Creativity, Attention, and Making Art, with Makoto Fujimura
    Apr 14 2025
    "Beholding is a countercultural act—it requires us to stop, to receive, and to fully see.” — Makoto Fujimura"Slow art is an invitation to linger, to notice, and to let the world unfold before us." — Makoto FujimuraYou are a beautiful masterpiece. But the practice of living artfully comes slowly, often through brokenness, weakness, or failure. Contemporary artist Makoto Fujimura integrates traditional Japanese styles with abstract expressionism and Christian theology, to explore the beauty that can emerge from the ashes pain and suffering. Both his art and his writing call us to behold the gift of creation, participate in its redemption, accentuating the cracks and fractures in our lives, so that grace might abound.Makoto Fujimura—renowned artist, writer, and theologian—joins Dr. Pam King to explore the deep connections between art, faith, and flourishing. Fujimura shares how his Japanese heritage and study of traditional Nihonga painting have shaped his understanding of creativity as a sacred act. Through themes of brokenness, beauty, and slow art, he challenges us to rethink success, embrace imperfection, and create from a place of love and abundance. Whether you're an artist, a person of faith, or someone seeking meaning in a hurried world, this conversation will invite you to slow down, behold, and embrace the mystery and beauty of life.Mako Fujimura integrates his artmaking, theology, and culture care advocacy into a beautiful expression of thriving and spiritual health. Through his breathtaking expressionist style, distinctively Japanese methods, and his rooted Christian convictions, he’s bringing beauty into being, and inviting us to do the same.In this conversation with Mako Fujimura, we discuss:What art is, what creativity means, and the human capacity for making beautyHow we can live artfully through imperfection, brokenness, trauma, and sufferingHow the practice of a gift economy can lead to mutual thrivingThe slow art of pausing, stopping, and beholding that contributes to our mental and spiritual healthAnd the connection between knowledge and love in a life of creativity and artmaking.Helpful Links and ResourcesFollow Makoto Fujimura on X @iamfujimuraView Mako’s art at makotofujimura.comMakoto Fujimura’s WritingsMakoto Fujimura’s BooksNihonga Art and its TraditionsRefractions: A Journey of Art, Faith, & CultureCulture Care: Reconnecting with Beauty for Our Common LifeSilence and Beauty: Hidden Faith Born of SufferingArt and Faith: A Theology of MakingEpisode Highlights"Art is fundamentally what human beings create—it is our capacity to make, and in making, we come to know.""Beholding is a countercultural act—it requires us to stop, to receive, and to fully see.”"We worship a wounded, glorified human being—our brokenness is not something to escape but something to offer.""Creativity is not about self-expression alone—it is about giving yourself away in love.""Slow art is an invitation to linger, to notice, and to let the world unfold before us."Show NotesMakoto Fujimura discusses the intersection of art, faith, and flourishingThe importance of beholding in a fast-paced worldHow brokenness and imperfection reveal deeper beautyNihonga painting and the wisdom of traditional Japanese artCreativity as an act of love and gift-givingThe Art of BeholdingWhy slowing down is essential for creativity and spiritual growthThe practice of beholding as a way of seeing the world more deeplyHow art invites us to be present and pay attentionThe connection between contemplation, creativity, and flourishing"Beholding is a countercultural act—it requires us to stop, to receive, and to fully see."Creativity, Faith, and Human FlourishingHow art and faith are intertwined in human thrivingThe spiritual discipline of making and creatingWhy true knowledge is connected to love and experience"Art is fundamentally what human beings create—it is our capacity to make, and in making, we come to know."How community fosters creativity and growthBrokenness, Beauty, and the Theology of MakingThe Japanese tradition of Kintsugi and embracing imperfectionHow Jesus’ wounds and resurrection shape our view of brokennessThe gift economy vs. the transactional economy in art"We worship a wounded, glorified human being—our brokenness is not something to escape but something to offer."Learning to see beauty in what is discarded or overlookedThe Practice of Slow ArtWhy slowing down is essential for deep engagement with artHow layers in Nihonga painting reveal new depths over time"Slow art is an invitation to linger, to notice, and to let the world unfold before us."How slowing down fosters healing and deeper connectionThe role of patience and attentiveness in both art and lifeLiving a Creative and Generous LifeHow to cultivate creativity in daily life, even outside traditional artsThe role of community in sustaining creative workWhy generosity and self-giving are essential to true creativity"Creativity...
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    1 h y 3 m
  • Life and Faith After Spiritual Abuse and Religious Trauma, with Dan Koch

    Life and Faith After Spiritual Abuse and Religious Trauma, with Dan Koch
    Mar 31 2025
    "Spirituality is like nuclear fission—it has the power to illuminate and energize but also to destroy when mishandled." — Dan Koch"Thriving isn't about a perfect life; it's about alignment between our deepest values and our lived reality." — Dan KochOn our path to spiritual health, we need to keep our eyes open to the ways religion and spirituality have been exploited to coerce, control, and create chaos. Focusing on the intersection of religion and psychology, licensed therapist, researcher, and podcaster Dan Koch is creating a public conversation about spiritual harm and abuse, helping victims learn how to deal with spiritual trauma, and offering insight and guidance toward healthy religious and spiritual experiences.From his own personal journey of religious trauma to his extensive research on spiritual abuse, Dan shares insights on how faith communities can both wound and restore. The conversation covers the psychological impact of religious trauma, the complexities of self-diagnosis, and practical strategies for self-knowledge and healing for anyone who has wrestled with faith, struggled with past church experiences, or have lost their religion.In this conversation with Dan Koch, we discuss:The psychological study of spiritual abuse and harm, including conceptual definitions and the many factors that come along with them.The symptoms and most recognizable patterns that point to spiritual abuseThe impact of abuse and trauma on psychological and spiritual healthHow to reappraise and challenge harmful core beliefsAnd how to find healing, joy, and transcendence as we deal with past trauma.Spirituality: Pro-Social Benefits, with a Shadow Side of Harm, Exploitation, and ViolenceThrough With & For, as well as the broader work of The Thrive Center, we regularly explore the expansive benefits and positives that emerge from our inherent spirituality as human beings, and how that relates to our individual and collective thriving.Religion and spirituality can be an immense force for good, offering countless pro-social benefits to the world, helping us our innate spiritual capacities is an essential factor in what it means to thrive.But we have to acknowledge the harm and vice and corruption—the violence— that has been perpetrated through religious and spiritual contexts. Spiritual abuse is a serious matter and there’s no way we can cultivate a full understanding or integrated experience of healthy spirituality without coming to terms with its prevalence and effects.Dan Koch’s attention to spiritual harm and abuse is about clearing the way toward a healthier spirituality grounded in care and healing. By exposing and exploring past traumas in the context of heathy and respectful relationships, we can grow into a more joyful faith and transcendent spiritual life.About Dan KochDan Koch is a licensed therapist supporting patients working through the trauma of spiritual abuse; and his work and insight in this domain emerges from his empirical research. He’s also host of the You Have Permission podcast. With a background in philosophy and theology, he explores questions of faith, doubt, and spiritual well-being. His research focuses on the psychological effects of religious trauma and how individuals can heal from spiritual abuse.Find more of his work at dankochwords.com.You can find his podcast, You Have Permission wherever you listen to podcasts and find exclusive episodes at patreon.com/dankoch.Helpful Links and ResourcesDan Koch’s WebsiteJoin Dan Koch’s PatreonYou Have Permission PodcastDan Koch’s Research on Spiritual AbuseThe Spiritual Harm and Abuse Scale Clinical ScreenerDevelopment of the Spiritual Harm and Abuse Scale (Article, May 2022)Quotable"I would just distinguish between self-knowledge and self-diagnosis—one leads to growth, the other can lead to unnecessary fear.""Avoidance is both a symptom of trauma and a cause of it—it keeps the rest of the symptoms around.""Spirituality is like nuclear fission—it has the power to illuminate and energize but also to destroy when mishandled.""You can't worship a villain—when spiritual abuse distorts your image of God, it becomes almost impossible to stay in faith.""Thriving isn't about a perfect life; it's about alignment between our deepest values and our lived reality."Show NotesDan Koch on spiritual abuse, religious trauma, and healingHow beliefs about God shape emotional well-beingPractical self-knowledge exercises to promote healingThe impact of fear-based religious teachings on mental healthStrategies for deconstructing harmful religious experiencesUnderstanding Spiritual Abuse and Religious TraumaDefinition and key elements of spiritual abuseDifference between spiritual harm and abuseThe role of power, control, and coercion in religious settingsHow religious trauma manifests in daily lifeConnection between religious trauma and PTSDThe Psychological and Emotional Impact of Religious TraumaThe interplay between faith, fear, and ...
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    1 h y 32 m
  • Recovering the Sacred in an Age of Anxiety, with Dr. Varun Soni

    Recovering the Sacred in an Age of Anxiety, with Dr. Varun Soni
    Mar 17 2025
    We need a recovery of the sacred in our secular world. Because the mental, emotional, and psychological struggles haunting society right now can’t be solved without addressing meaning, purpose, and the longing for connection to something beyond ourselves.In other words, spiritual health is an essential part of mental health.An attorney, religious scholar, and university chaplain, Dr. Varun Soni is Dean of Religious Life at the University of Southern California, and is leading us back to our true north, through spacious and life-giving spiritual conversations and sacred practices that realign us to our values and identity.In this conversation with Varun Soni, we discuss:Finding the sacred in our secular culture.Religious pluralism and what it means to build trust that reaches across religious lines of difference.The transformative power of finding your “truth north”—your North Star—to orient our journeys of faith and spirituality.Varun shares six pillars of flourishing; how to align our actions with our values; and the benefit of listening to the cultural narratives and stories we tell.He reflects on the missing elements of spirituality in our understanding of mental health today, evidenced in his work with teens and emerging adults.He offers us a Hindu meditative practice to provide inner clarity, stability, and calm.And he comments on compassion and a cultivation sacred spiritual practices to counteract the loneliness, anguish, and suffering in our world.Show NotesDr. Pam King welcomes Varun Soni, Dean of Religious and Spiritual Life at USCJourney from Hindu attorney to first Hindu Dean of Religious and Spiritual Life in the U.S.“What does it mean to be Indian? What does it mean to be Hindu? What does it mean to be American? What is this Indian American experience?”1965 Immigration and Naturalization ActInspired by grandfather’s connection to Mahatma Gandhi“ What it meant to be Hindu was to be like Gandhi. What it meant to be Indian was to be like Gandhi. What it meant to live a meaningful life was to live like Gandhi.”“ I continued to study religion as a way of understanding myself.”Sitting with the Dalai Lama on Mahatma Gandhi’s birthdayMentorship from the Dalai LamaDeepak Chopra’s influence“Interfaith trust building”University ChaplaincyWhat is thriving to you?"Thriving is the alignment of purpose and practice—it’s not about arriving, but about moving in the right direction."“What is my north star, and how do I get there?”Spiritual well-being about asking the right questions, not having all the answersReligion once provided meaning, rituals, and community—now young people seek new structures"What is sacred to you? If you can’t answer that, you’re drifting without a compass."The urgency of time when turning 50 years old“I’m not trying to prove anything to anyone anymore.”“Put the process before the answer.”6 pillars of thriving and well-being: diet, sleep, exercise, contemplative practice, emotional intelligence, connection to natureBasic physical pillars of thriving: Diet, Sleep, ExerciseSpiritual pillars of thriving: Contemplation, Emotional Intelligence, and Communing with NatureFinding what is sacred—faith, relationships, personal values51% of USC students non-religious, 80% spiritualRecord levels of loneliness, imposter syndrome, comparison culture“Not just a mental health crisis, but a spiritual health crisis.”Loss of intergenerational religious experiences—key protective factor against depression"We took away religion and replaced it with social media, then wondered why anxiety skyrocketed."Social media fuels disconnection rather than community"We weren’t built for this much bad news. Our brains weren’t designed to process global suffering 24/7."“There’s no right way to do contemplative practice.”Find moments built into your dayExercise: So Hum breath meditation: Inhale “So,” exhale “Hum”Using meditation as a spiritual technology or tool"You are not your thoughts—you are the awareness behind them."Identity shaped by personal narrative—"If you don’t like your story, rewrite it."Telling the story of who you will become"Every individual is the hero of their own journey, whether they realize it or not."Cultural mythology, from sacred texts to Marvel movies, reflects search for meaningSpirituality helps build redemptive life narratives“There power in being part of something bigger.”The Spiritual Child by Lisa Miller—research on spirituality and mental health"It’s hard to hate the people you love—universities are one of the last places where people can learn to love each other across differences."Technology and mediated relationshipsWhat is sacred to you?"Gen Z’s greatest superpower is empathy, but they’ve never been lonelier."Building protective factors for young peopleGratitude rituals shift focus from anxiety to appreciationCare, justice, and connectionMental Health CrisisMental Health and ...
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    1 h y 19 m
  • Wondering Our Way to Courage, Emotional Health, and a Life of Listening, with Kelly Corrigan

    Wondering Our Way to Courage, Emotional Health, and a Life of Listening, with Kelly Corrigan
    Mar 3 2025
    In our world of urgency, certitudes, and immediate access to a flood of information, could it be that a humble curiosity, inspired awe, and delightful wonder might give us the strength to heal and thrive?Using an expansive emotional vocabulary matched with wit and care, TV host, podcaster, and author Kelly Corrigan is inviting the world to relational vulnerability, compassionate curiosity, and stalwart bravery to face our biggest problems through listening and loving wonder.In this conversation with Kelly Corrigan, we discuss:Her approach to having conversations that feel transformative—the kind that unlock and open us upHow wonder grounds her spirituality and personal vocationThe profound lessons she learned from her mother and father, and how each showed up for her when she was at her lowestHow to learn wisdom and leadership through coaching and mentoringHow to build the emotional container of home for a familyWhat it means to be brave in our world todayAnd how to communicate love through the simple act of listening through three simple invitations: “Tell me more!, What else?, and Go on.”About Kelly CorriganKelly Corrigan is a journalist of wonder. Through hundreds and hundreds of conversations with some of the world’s most interesting people, she approaches both timeless questions and contemporary problems … through focused and generous listening, an attitude of awe, and a joyful expectation to be surprised and delighted, even in life’s most challenging and painful circumstances.She’s the author of four New York Times bestselling memoirs: Tell Me More, The Middle Place, Glitter and Glue, and Lift. Her most recent offering is a children’s book, Hello World, which celebrates the people in our lives and explores the meaningful connections that come from asking each other questions.Her podcast, Kelly Corrigan Wonders, is a library of conversational wisdom ranging from current events, to arts and entertainment, to psychology and philosophy, and an approach to spirituality and transcendence through the gift of everyday, ordinary life.A master of conversational hospitality, downright funny storytelling, and journalistic listening, she’s also the PBS television host of Tell Me More, and recently spoke on Bravery at the 40th annual TED Conference.You can find her podcast, Kelly Corrigan Wonders wherever you listen to podcasts and her full library of resources at kellycorrigan.com.Books and Media by Kelly CorriganListen to Kelly Corrigan WondersVisit [KellyCorrigan.com](http://KellyCorrigan.comhttps://www.kellycorrigan.com/)Watch Tell Me More with Kelly Corrigan (PBS)Read Kelly’s books, such as Tell Me More, The Middle Place, Glitter and Glue, Hello World!, and Lift.Show NotesKelly Corrigan’s storytelling and journalismKelly’s interviews with famous figures like Bono, Bryan Stevenson, David Byrne, and Melinda Gates.Celebrities are just people.“What happens almost instantly… is that they become people.”“You are a never-to-be-repeated miracle.”Core questions to know a person:  ”Who raised  you, and where, and what happened  that you still remember vividly.”Finding the extraordinary in the ordinary”All the quotidian facts of their life that make us equals in some  weird way, it puts you at ease.”“There's this story about how being an adult is holding in one pocket that you are ashes to ashes, dust to dust, one of billions And holding in the other pocket that you are a never to be repeated miracle. And that adulthood is knowing when to pull out which piece of paper.”Childhood and parental influence reveal deep insights into a person’s adult self.Vivid childhood memories help shape storytelling and personal understanding.“A strong, detailed memory of an experience is an indicator that there’s a lot there for you.”Famous people also deal with everyday concerns, which makes them relatable.“They’re just looking for a sandwich at lunchtime.”Perspective shifts with age, realizing that many things once thought important aren’t.“There’s 8 billion people here. It doesn’t matter what I say and do.”Embracing the paradox of being both insignificant and uniquely valuable.“Being an adult is holding in one pocket that you are ashes to ashes, dust to dust… and in the other pocket that you are a never-to-be-repeated miracle.”Kelly’s father, George Corrigan, was an enthusiastic listener and deeply engaging with others.“The thing you need to know about me is I’m George Corrigan’s daughter.”Her father’s ability to find something lovable in everyone influenced her deeply.“He wasn’t looking for people just like him… he could become engaged in something he knew nothing about.”Kelly Corrigan's TED Talk, "To Love Is to Be Brave"Her mother, Mary Corrigan, was structured, disciplined, and devoted to family. “She went to church every single day.”Passed away six weeks before the interview, leaving a strong legacy.”I felt like I  ...
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    1 h y 19 m
  • Listening to Our Emotions: Healing Through Self-Compassion, Grief, and Acceptance, with Dr. David C. Wang

    Listening to Our Emotions: Healing Through Self-Compassion, Grief, and Acceptance, with Dr. David C. Wang
    Feb 17 2025
    Emotional health is deeply intertwined in an ongoing journey with spiritual health. This involves opening to our pain, grieving our trauma, and patiently cultivating a resilience that stabilizes and secures our relationships and our sense of self.With compassion, pastoral presence, and emotional attunement, psychologist Dr. David Wang is using psychological and theological tools to help us understand and adapt to emotional realities, explore the wounds of our past, and find healing and strength through acceptance and grief.In this conversation with David Wang, we discuss:The difference between human development and spiritual formation and how to understand maturityThe centrality of relationships in human life and growth, and how that’s grounded in divine relationality and our communion with GodHow to become friends with ourselves, offering self-compassion and being moved by our own sufferingThe impact of childhood trauma on adult emotional, psychological, and spiritual healthAnd finally, how a practice of grief can help us understand and work through traumatic experiences and move toward healing.Show NotesChristian theology and formationA philosophical approach to theologically informed strategies for transformation and growthHow the relational aspects of God ground an approach to therapy and spiritual formationWhat are the markers of maturity?Relatedness and connection to others facilitates the process of human growth and developmentEmotional building blocks and relational capacities for maturityDave Wang on spiritual health and thrivingTheological and psychological frameworks of thrivingHolding the beautiful beside the brokenBecoming friends with ourselvesShow compassion, be moved by our own suffering, and accept limitations as we strive toward the hard work we’re all called to.Two paradoxical needs to achieve spiritual maturity and healthWe are made for relationships, but we also need independenceBalanceSpiritual and emotional maturityFormation through practice, education, and healthy developmentCan virtue be taught?Can maturity be educated?Can we learn to thrive and be spiritually healthy?In the Realm of Hungry Ghosts, Dr. Gabor Maté writes that “The attempt to escape from pain is what creates more pain.”When our brains and our bodies go into survival modeAvoidance as a coping mechanism or strategyChildhood trauma in childhood“When the psychic pain is so unbearable, the felt threat so intimidating, we mentally and emotionally try to escape.”Childhood trauma can reemerge in adult behaviors, relationships, habits, language, even physical illness or conditions.Do I have trauma that I haven’t dealt with?The symptoms or signs of traumaHow to approach the process of seeking help and healing.Concrete practices that can help and heal traumatic experienceLearning to grieveChristian spiritual practices of prayerThe emotional practice of grief and acceptanceDr. Pam King’s Key TakeawaysHuman beings need both relationships and independence. And learning how to balance and integrate them is a marker of our maturity.Though we may try to escape from pain, to deal with trauma we need to practice acceptance and grief. It’s a difficult and complex relational process that brings us closer to healing and wholeness.We can befriend ourselves in our pain through a practice of self-compassion.In this life, we have to hold beauty beside brokenness. Cultivating the capacity to do so is the hard work of growth into spiritual and emotional maturity, and the joyful journey of thriving.www.drdavidcwang.comhttps://www.seminaryformationproject.com/About David WangDr. David Wang is a licensed psychologist and Associate Professor of Psychology at Fuller Theological Seminary, where he’s also the Cliff and Joyce Penner Chair for the Formation of Emotionally Healthy Leaders and scholar in residence at Fuller’s Center for Spiritual Formation. He speaks and trains leaders globally on trauma informed care. And he conducts research and teaches courses in Trauma Therapy, Dialectical Behavior Therapy, Multicultural Psychology, and the Integration of Psychology and the Christian faith. He is also Pastor of Spiritual Formation at One Life City Church in Fullerton, California. About the Thrive CenterLearn more at thethrivecenter.org.Follow us on Instagram @thrivecenterFollow us on X @thrivecenterFollow us on LinkedIn @thethrivecenter About Dr. Pam KingDr. Pam King is Executive Director the Thrive Center and is Peter L. Benson Professor of Applied Developmental Science at Fuller School of Psychology & Marriage and Family Therapy. Follow her @drpamking. About With & ForHost: Pam KingSenior Director and Producer: Jill WestbrookOperations Manager: Lauren KimSocial Media Graphic Designer: Wren JuergensenConsulting Producer: Evan RosaSpecial thanks to the team at Fuller Studio and the Fuller School of Psychology & Marriage and Family Therapy.
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    1 h y 6 m
  • The Psychology of Disaster: The Impact of Calamity on Mental, Emotional, and Spiritual Health, with Dr. Jamie Aten and Dr. Pam King

    The Psychology of Disaster: The Impact of Calamity on Mental, Emotional, and Spiritual Health, with Dr. Jamie Aten and Dr. Pam King
    Feb 12 2025
    “Meaning making is so fundamental to who we are as humans, and when that’s ruptured, it’s devastating.” (Dr. Pam King, from this episode)“Spiritual fortitude is different from resilience … it helps us to realize that we still learn to live in the midst of suffering. … It helps us metabolize our suffering.” (Dr. Jamie Aten, from this episode)One of the hopeful things in the aftermath of the Los Angeles fires is how I have seen people within L.A. show up with and for each other. And I'm especially grateful for this audience because I know you are all people who care to show up with people, and for people. Thank you for being light in these hard times.And I was talking with Evan Rosa. The producer and host of For the Life of the World (Yale Center for Faith & Culture) about the turbulent times that we are experiencing in Los Angeles.And I was also speaking about experts who deal with trauma, disaster, psychological first aid, spiritual first aid, and also reflecting on my own experiences of watching the community around me evaporate. Evan had the great idea to invite me and Dr. Jamie Aten, the head of Wheaton's Humanitarian Disaster Institute, for an interview.And I think you'll resonate with a lot of the themes of this episode, even if you aren't living in the midst of a disaster.We all have challenges, and these are great moments to dig deep and live connected with each other and for each other in purposeful ways.So what follows is sharing our interview with Evan Rosa. Thanks for listening.Show Notes (from the episode page of For the Life of the World)Disaster preparedness is sort of an oxymoron. Disaster is the kind of indiscriminate calamity that only ever finds us ill-equipped to manage. And if you are truly prepared, you’ve probably averted disaster.There’s a big difference between the impact of disaster on physical, material life—and its outsized impact on mental, emotional, and spiritual life.Personal disasters like a terminal illness, natural disasters like the recent fires that razed southern Californian communities, the impact of endless, senseless wars … these all cause a pain and physical damage that can be mitigated or rebuilt. But the worst of these cases threaten to destroy the very meaning of our lives.No wonder disaster takes such a psychological and spiritual toll. There’s an urgent need to find or even make meaning from it. To somehow explain it, justify why God would allow it, and tell a grand story that makes sense from the senseless.These are difficult questions, and my guests today both have personal experience with disaster. Dr. Pam King is the Peter L. Benson Professor of Applied Developmental Science at Fuller School of Psychology, and the Executive Director the Thrive Center. She’s an ordained Presbyterian minister, and she hosts a podcast on psychology and spirituality called With & For. Dr. Jamie Aten is a disaster psychologist and disaster ministry expert, helping others navigate mass, humanitarian, and personal disasters with scientific and spiritual insights. He is the Founder and Executive Director of the Humanitarian Disaster Institute Wheaton College, where he holds the Blanchard Chair of Humanitarian & Disaster Leadership. He is author of A Walking Disaster: What Surviving Katrina and Cancer Taught Me about Faith and Resilience.In this conversation, Pam King and Jamie Aten join Evan Rosa to discuss:Each of their personal encounters with disasters—both fire and cancerThe psychological study of disasterThe personal impact of disaster on mental, emotional, and spiritual healthThe difference between resilience and fortitudeAnd the theological and practical considerations for how to live through disastrous events.About Pam KingPam King is Executive Director the Thrive Center and is Peter L. Benson Professor of Applied Developmental Science at Fuller School of Psychology & Marriage and Family Therapy. She hosts the With & For podcast, and you can follow her @drpamking.About Jamie AtenJamie D. Aten is a disaster psychologist and disaster ministry expert. He helps others navigate mass, humanitarian, and personal disasters with scientific and spiritual insights. He is the Founder and Executive Director of the Humanitarian Disaster Institute and Disaster Ministry Conference and holds the Blanchard Chair of Humanitarian & Disaster Leadership at Wheaton College. And he’s the author of A Walking Disaster: What Surviving Katrina and Cancer Taught Me about Faith and Resilience.Show NotesHumanitarian Disaster InstituteSpiritual First AidJamie Aten’s A Walking Disaster: What Surviving Katrina and Cancer Taught Me about Faith and ResilienceThe Thrive Center at Fuller SeminaryPam King’s personal experience fighting fires in the Eaton Fire in January 20255,000 homes destroyed55 schools and houses of worship are gone“Neighborhoods are annihilated …”Jamie Aten offers an overview of the impact of disasters on humanity, and the human ...
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    1 h y 1 m
  • From Rupture to Repair: Relationships, Emotional Regulation, and Our Social Brains, with Dr. Tina Bryson

    From Rupture to Repair: Relationships, Emotional Regulation, and Our Social Brains, with Dr. Tina Bryson
    Feb 3 2025
    Our brains hold our relational history—all the joys, all the ruptures, all the repairs. And even in the most difficult childhood or parenting circumstances, the science of relationships and connection can give us hope for whole-brain and whole-life transformation.Therapist, bestselling author, and mom—Dr. Tina Payne Bryson is seeking a connection revolution that brings neurobiology and practical relational wisdom to bear on both how we were parented, how we parent, and how we relate throughout our lifespan.In this conversation with Tina Bryson, we discuss:The science of childhood relational development and growth into strong, adaptive adultsThe brain as our most social organ—capable of holding a lifetime of relational and emotional historyHow to emotionally co-regulate with another person to achieve a calm, peaceful, and vibrant relationshipNeuroplasticity and our ability to change with intention toward our deepest held valuesAnd we explore how the science of connection, attachment, and interpersonal neurobiology sheds light on how we were parented, and impacts how we might parent ourselves and how we relate to everyone.Books by Dr. Tina BrysonThe Way of Play (Tina’s latest book!)The Whole-Brain ChildNo-Drama DisciplineThe Yes BrainThe Power of Showing UpFollow Tina BrysonTinaBryson.com Instagram X The Center for ConnectionShow NotesDr. Tina Bryson: an expert in neurobiology, parenting, child development, and attachment theory.Highlighting Tina’s unique perspective as both a clinician and science-engaged researcher.This conversation focuses on parenting, but it’s relevant for everyone—whether you’re a leader, mentor, or someone reflecting on your own upbringingThe importance of connection, attunement, and emotional regulation in today’s world."I feel so aware that this is not an easy time to be a child or a teenager in the world."Kids today face unique challenges that are very different from previous generations:More stimulation, information, and pressure than ever before.Earlier onset of puberty and adolescence, with young adults taking longer to launch."We often talk about the challenges of youth, which are absolutely real, but we don’t want to forget that in many ways, the world is actually safer."Positive shifts in youth well-being: fewer teen pregnancies; safer environments (cars, car seats, public spaces)l greater awareness of mental health, substance use, and emotional well-beingWhat Do You Say?: How to Talk with Kids to Build Motivation, Stress Tolerance, and a Happy Home, by William Stixrud and Ned JohnsonThe brain is a social organ—we are profoundly shaped by the people around us."A huge contributor to some of the struggles youth are having is because their grownups are not thriving."Interpersonal neurobiology teaches that children’s well-being is tied to their caregivers’ ability to regulate their own emotions.Takeaway: Parents who are anxious, reactive, or dysregulated create environments where their children struggle to regulate their emotions."The greatest gift we can give each other is a calm presence."“History is not destiny.”Emotional offloading or outsourcingSafe haven or safe harbor: cozy, safe, calm“My mom will never listen.”Understanding teenagers“Please don’t chase your child and force connection.”Non-eye contact feels less intrusive and they’ll open up moreUnderstanding Attachment & The Four S’s: Safe, Seen, Soothed, SecureSecure attachment is a key predictor of well-being in children and adults.Attachment is built through repeated experiences of the Four S’s:Safe: "Do I feel physically and emotionally secure with this person?"Seen: "Does this person understand and acknowledge my emotions and experiences?"Soothed: "When I’m in distress, does this person help me feel better?"Secure: "Do I trust that this person will be there for me consistently?"Set an intention: "When my child walks through the door, I want them to feel at rest, safe, and accepted."Practical Parenting Tip: If your child pushes you away, don’t force connection. Instead, say: "I can see you need some space right now. I’m here whenever you’re ready to talk."Managing Teen Independence: When teens ask for space, don’t take it personally. Instead, try: "I’m here if you want to talk later.""Would you be open to a short walk or helping me in the kitchen?"The basics of attachment theory: John Bowlby and Mary AinsworthMama BearsNot just brain, but whole nervous systemSecure Relating: Holding Your Own in an Insecure World, by Sue Marriot and Ann Kelley"Without awareness, we don’t have choice."—Dan SiegelHistory is not destiny. We can rewire our brains and create new, healthier patterns in relationships.The availability of your presence creates a secure environmentRegulation & Emotional ResilienceDefinition of Regulation: The ability to monitor and modify emotional states rather than reacting impulsively.It’s NOT about being emotionless—it’s about ...
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