In this episode of Top Self, Shanenn sits down with physician and author Dr. Frank Spinelli to talk about shame, why it can become so deeply tied to jealousy and insecurity, and how one triggering moment can quickly turn into a spiral.

You get triggered. You check the phone, withdraw, accuse, react, or do something you later regret. Then comes the second layer: “Why did I do that?” “What’s wrong with me?” “Why am I like this?”

That’s where shame can take over.

Dr. Spinelli explains the difference between guilt and shame, why old wounds can shape the way we interpret what is happening in the present, and how the voice in our head can become the most damaging part of the cycle.

He also shares the framework behind his book, The Shame Compass: A Radical Framework for Trauma Healing and Self-Acceptance, and explains why shame may not be something we simply “get over.” Instead, it can become information that helps us understand what is being activated, where it may be coming from, and how we can respond differently.

Key Moments

• The difference between guilt and shame

• Why shame can become a belief about who you are, not just something you did

• How past trauma and painful experiences can get replayed in present relationships

• Why the voice in your head can become an unreliable narrator

• The difference between having a thought and treating that thought as a fact

• Why practicing the pause outside of triggering moments can help you respond differently when emotions are high

• How shame can turn jealousy into a loop of checking, reacting, judging yourself, and repeating the behavior

• Why the most damaging part of the spiral may be what you tell yourself after the trigger

• The COMPASS framework and how Dr. Spinelli uses it to help people understand shame

• Why acceptance does not mean excusing, minimizing, or pretending something didn’t happen

• How core values can help you understand when shame is pointing to something that feels out of alignment

• The areas where women often experience shame, including body image, motherhood, fertility, sexuality, aging, career ambition, and relationship status

Golden Episode Nuggets

💎 Guilt says, “I did something wrong.” Shame says, “I am wrong.”

💎 A thought is not automatically a fact just because it showed up in your mind.

💎 The trigger may start the reaction, but shame can keep the cycle going.

💎 The story you tell yourself after you react can be more damaging than the reaction itself.

💎 Practicing the pause when you are calm makes it easier to access when you are triggered.

💎 Sometimes we bring old wounds into current relationships and unconsciously try to get a different ending.

💎 Shame does not always need to disappear before you can move forward.

💎 Shame can be information about what is being activated, what story you are telling yourself, and what needs your attention.

About Our Guest

Dr. Frank Spinelli is a physician, author, speaker, and advocate whose work explores trauma, shame, addiction, and emotional health.

Drawing from both his professional experience and his personal history as a survivor of childhood sexual abuse, Dr. Spinelli developed the COMPASS framework to help people better understand and navigate shame.

His book, The Shame Compass: A Radical Framework for Trauma Healing and Self-Acceptance, explores how shame can be recognized, understood, and used as information rather than treated as proof that something is fundamentally wrong with you.

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Disclaimer
The information on this podcast or any platform affiliated with Top Self LLC, or the Top Self podcast is for informational and entertainment purposes only. No material associated with Top Self podcast is intended to be a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis or treatment, Always seek the advice of your physician or other qualified health care provider with any questions you may have regarding your condition or treatment and before taking on or performing any of the activities or suggestions discussed on the podcast or website.

Purchase Daniels Book - Hard Feelings: Finding the Wisdom in Our Darkest Emotions

In this episode of Top Self, Shanenn sits down with psychotherapist and New York Times bestselling author Daniel Smith to explore a question most of us never stop to ask:

What if the emotions you're trying hardest to get rid of are actually trying to help you?

Whether it's jealousy, shame, envy, regret, or anxiety, many of us spend our lives chasing relief—seeking reassurance, distracting ourselves, or trying to think our way out of uncomfortable feelings. But according to Daniel, our darkest emotions aren't problems to eliminate. They're messengers carrying important information about who we are, what we fear, and what needs our attention.

Together, Shanenn and Daniel talk about why self-criticism often causes more damage than the original emotion, how shame keeps us trapped in painful cycles, and why curiosity may be one of the most powerful tools for healing.

If you've ever wondered why you keep having the same emotional reactions despite knowing "better," this conversation is for you.

Golden Episode Nuggets:

💎 Emotions are messengers, not enemies

💎 The feeling itself is rarely the problem—our resistance to it often is

💎 Shame says "there's something wrong with me," not simply "I did something wrong"

💎 Self-hatred is not an effective strategy for personal growth

💎 Curiosity creates space where judgment creates suffering

💎 Understanding yourself is often more powerful than trying to fix yourself

💎 The goal isn't to never feel difficult emotions again—it's to relate to them differently

About Our Guest:

Daniel Smith is a psychotherapist, journalist, and New York Times bestselling author of Monkey Mind. His latest book, Hard Feelings: Finding the Wisdom in Our Darkest Emotions, explores emotions such as shame, envy, regret, despair, and annoyance—revealing how these often-misunderstood feelings can become powerful sources of self-understanding and growth.

Through personal stories, psychological insight, and cultural exploration, Daniel challenges the idea that difficult emotions should simply be eliminated and instead invites us to learn from them.

Resources Mentioned:

Hard Feelings: Finding the Wisdom in Our Darkest Emotions by Daniel Smith

Monkey Mind by Daniel Smith

The Buddhist Parable of the Second Arrow

Quote of the Episode:

"Emotions don't come because they're trying to attack us. Emotions come because they have meaning and because they have purpose." – Daniel Smith

Key Moments:

• 2:00 – Why our desperate search for emotional relief often backfires

• 5:00 – The Buddhist "Second Arrow" and how we create unnecessary suffering

• 9:00 – Why understanding the "why" behind your feelings isn't always enough

• 12:00 – The difference between shame and guilt

• 16:00 – How curiosity can reduce emotional suffering

• 21:00 – Why talking about shame weakens its grip

• 24:00 – The hidden ways regret helps us avoid the present

• 33:00 – Why shame may be the most painful emotion of all

• 38:00 – How childhood experiences shape our emotional patterns as adults

Schedule your FREE Discovery Call to see how I can help.

Check us out on YouTube and make sure to subscribe

Grab the 5 Must-Haves To Overcome Jealousy



Disclaimer
The information on this podcast or any platform affiliated with Top Self LLC, or the Top Self podcast is for informational and entertainment purposes only. No material associated with Top Self podcast is intended to be a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis or treatment, Always seek the advice of your physician or other qualified health care provider with any questions you may have regarding your condition or treatment and before taking on or performing any of the activities or suggestions discussed on the podcast or website.

You messed up. You spiraled. You said something you wish you could take back. And now you feel terrible — which actually means you're doing something right. Feeling bad after a jealous episode is healthy. It means you care.

But there's a difference between feeling bad and living there. And if you're someone who stays in the spiral for hours, days, or even weeks after a jealous episode — replaying it, shutting down, telling yourself you're broken and unlovable — this episode is for you.

Because here's what that extended spiral is actually costing you. It's not just making you miserable. It's reinforcing the belief that jealousy is who you are. It's keeping the incident alive in your relationship long after it should be over. And it's exhausting your partner in ways you might not even realize.

Today Shanenn introduces the Pity Timer — a simple, deliberate tool for feeling your feelings fully without letting them swallow the next three days of your life. This isn't about stuffing it down or pretending it didn't happen. It's about giving your guilt its time, and then making a choice to move forward.
In this episode:

Why staying in the spiral actually reinforces jealous behavior
What your partner experiences when you're still "off" days later
Why moving on fast doesn't mean you don't care
How to use the Pity Timer to actually close the loop
What to do when the spiral tries to come back

00:00 Stop Letting the Spiral Run Your Life
02:14 How the Spiral Builds a Case Against You
05:19 How Your Guilt Is Hurting Your Partner
08:01 Why You Can't Just Stop Feeling Bad
10:29 How to Use the Pity Timer
13:02 What to Do During the Window
14:37 When the Timer Goes Off

Schedule your FREE Discovery Call to see how I can help.

Check us out on YouTube and make sure to subscribe

Grab the 5 Must-Haves To Overcome Jealousy



Disclaimer
The information on this podcast or any platform affiliated with Top Self LLC, or the Top Self podcast is for informational and entertainment purposes only. No material associated with Top Self podcast is intended to be a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis or treatment, Always seek the advice of your physician or other qualified health care provider with any questions you may have regarding your condition or treatment and before taking on or performing any of the activities or suggestions discussed on the podcast or website.