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What does it take to walk away from an ideology you were raised inside of — and then spend your career pulling others out of the same darkness?

Allizandra Herberhold grew up in a racially segregated community where white supremacist ideology was woven into the fabric of everyday life. She didn't choose it. It was handed to her by trusted adults who knew no other way. It wasn't until college — when her first roommate turned out to be a Black woman who showed her nothing but patience and kindness — that the fear she'd been carrying started to crack.

Today, Allizandra is a full-time Exit Interventionist with Parents for Peace, working directly with radicalized individuals across the ideological spectrum: neo-Nazis, ISIS supporters, incels, would-be school shooters, and more. Her approach treats radicalization like an addiction — and replaces shame with connection.

In this conversation with host Wilk Wilkinson, we get into the real mechanics of how hate takes root, why confronting ideology head-on almost never works, and how curiosity and compassion — paired with lived experience — become the most powerful tools in the room.

In This Episode:

• How Allizandra was exposed to white supremacist ideology growing up — and what began to change it

• What an Exit Interventionist actually does, and how long the process really takes

• Why Allizandra views radicalization through the lens of addiction

• The role of self-disclosure and lived experience in building trust with radicalized individuals

• Why you can't hate the hate out of someone — and what works instead

• The silencing of dissenting voices in higher education and what it costs us

• A final message: be curious, not condemning

Learn more about and connect with Allizandra Herberhold in the full show notes for this episode at www.DerateTheHate.com.

The world is a better place if we are better people. That begins with each of us as individuals. Be kind to one another. Be grateful for all you’ve got. Make every day the day that you want it to be!

Please follow The Derate The Hate podcast on:

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Subscribe to us wherever you enjoy your audio or from our site. Please leave us a rating and feedback on Apple podcasts or other platforms. You can share your thoughts or request Wilk for a speaking engagement on our contact page: DerateTheHate.com/Contact

The Derate The Hate podcast is proudly produced in collaboration with Braver Angels — America’s largest grassroots, cross-partisan organization working toward civic renewal and bridging partisan divides. Learn more: BraverAngels.org

Welcome to the Derate The Hate Podcast!

*The views expressed by Wilk, his guest hosts &/or guests on the Derate The Hate podcast are their own and should not be attributed to any organization they may otherwise be affiliated with.

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Can a divided nation actually agree on what children need? That's the question at the heart of this conversation.

Wilk sits down with Lauren Farrow — former public school teacher, founder of SchoolingAmerica.org, and education reform advocate — for an honest, nonpartisan look at what's really happening inside the American education system.

Lauren shares what she witnessed as a classroom teacher in the post-pandemic years: behavior struggles, academic decline, burnt-out teachers spending their own money on supplies, and a bureaucratic structure that strips educators of the very autonomy they need to actually help kids. She breaks down why the system isn't broken — it's functioning exactly as designed — and why that distinction matters for anyone who wants to fix it.

Together, Wilk and Lauren explore school choice and voucher programs, the reality of Title I school funding, the role of teachers unions, and most importantly: what parents and community members can actually do about it. The answer? Courageous citizenship. Show up. Get involved. Act instead of react.

Whether you have kids in school or not — you have skin in the game. Today's students are tomorrow's leaders.

Learn more about and connect with Lauren Farrow in the complete show notes for this episode at www.DerateTheHate.com.

The world is a better place if we are better people. That begins with each of us as individuals. Be kind to one another. Be grateful for all you’ve got. Make every day the day that you want it to be!

Please follow The Derate The Hate podcast on:

Facebook, Instagram, Twitter(X) , YouTube

Subscribe to us wherever you enjoy your audio or from our site. Please leave us a rating and feedback on Apple podcasts or other platforms. You can share your thoughts or request Wilk for a speaking engagement on our contact page: DerateTheHate.com/Contact

The Derate The Hate podcast is proudly produced in collaboration with Braver Angels — America’s largest grassroots, cross-partisan organization working toward civic renewal and bridging partisan divides. Learn more: BraverAngels.org

Welcome to the Derate The Hate Podcast!

*The views expressed by Wilk, his guest hosts &/or guests on the Derate The Hate podcast are their own and should not be attributed to any organization they may otherwise be affiliated with.

Send Wilk a text with your feedback! (incoming msgs only - I can't reply)

In Episode 304 of Derate The Hate, Wilk sits down with Mubin Shaikh — a former extremist who deradicalized after 9/11 and went on to work undercover against terrorism.

Born and raised in Toronto, Mubin experienced an identity crisis that led him toward violent Islamist extremism as a young man. But marriage, fatherhood, and the events of 9/11 forced him to confront hard questions about ideology, violence, and truth.

After studying Arabic and Islamic theology in Syria, he returned to Canada and became an undercover operative for the Canadian Security Intelligence Service. His work helped dismantle terror networks, including the infamous Toronto 18 case.

Today, Mubin works with Parents for Peace, helping families intervene before radicalization turns violent.

This episode explores:
• The psychology of radicalization
• Identity crisis and youth vulnerability
• Moral dilemmas of undercover work
• The online pipeline to extremism
• Parenting in the digital age
• Courageous citizenship and reclaiming agency

Radicalization isn’t “over there.” It can happen anywhere the ingredients are present.

Learn more about and connect with Mubin Shaikh by getting the full show notes at www.DerateTheHate.com.

The world is a better place if we are better people. That begins with each of us as individuals. Be kind to one another. Be grateful for all you’ve got. Make every day the day that you want it to be!

Please follow The Derate The Hate podcast on:

Facebook, Instagram, Twitter(X) , YouTube

Subscribe to us wherever you enjoy your audio or from our site. Please leave us a rating and feedback on Apple podcasts or other platforms. You can share your thoughts or request Wilk for a speaking engagement on our contact page: DerateTheHate.com/Contact

The Derate The Hate podcast is proudly produced in collaboration with Braver Angels — America’s largest grassroots, cross-partisan organization working toward civic renewal and bridging partisan divides. Learn more: BraverAngels.org

Welcome to the Derate The Hate Podcast!

*The views expressed by Wilk, his guest hosts &/or guests on the Derate The Hate podcast are their own and should not be attributed to any organization they may otherwise be affiliated with.

Send Wilk a text with your feedback! (incoming msgs only - I can't reply)

In Episode 303 of Derate The Hate, Wilk Wilkinson sits down with poet and author April Ossmann to explore how poetry can become a powerful tool for bridging America’s political divide.

April is the author of We: Poems (Red Hen Press, 2025), a collection devoted to healing polarization through empathy, metaphor, and shared humanity. A recent member of Braver Angels, she brings a unique voice to the civic renewal movement — one grounded not in rhetoric, but in soul.

In this episode, they discuss:

• How poetry fosters understanding where arguments fail
• The difference between compromise and “synergizing”
• Why civility is strength — not weakness
• Family estrangement and political division
• Listening with intention
• Seeing past ego to soul
• April’s “Peace Hymn for the Republic”

If you care about democracy, dialogue, and restoring decency in public life, this conversation will challenge and inspire you.

Learn more about April Ossmann in the full show notes for this episode at www.DerateTheHate.com.

The world is a better place if we are better people. That begins with each of us as individuals. Be kind to one another. Be grateful for all you’ve got. Make every day the day that you want it to be!

Please follow The Derate The Hate podcast on:

Facebook, Instagram, Twitter(X) , YouTube

Subscribe to us wherever you enjoy your audio or from our site. Please leave us a rating and feedback on Apple podcasts or other platforms. You can share your thoughts or request Wilk for a speaking engagement on our contact page: DerateTheHate.com/Contact

The Derate The Hate podcast is proudly produced in collaboration with Braver Angels — America’s largest grassroots, cross-partisan organization working toward civic renewal and bridging partisan divides. Learn more: BraverAngels.org

Welcome to the Derate The Hate Podcast!

*The views expressed by Wilk, his guest hosts &/or guests on the Derate The Hate podcast are their own and should not be attributed to any organization they may otherwise be affiliated with.

Send Wilk a text with your feedback! (incoming msgs only - I can't reply)

In this episode of Derate The Hate, Wilk Wilkinson sits down with award-winning filmmaker Michael Premo to discuss Homegrown, his powerful documentary exploring the motivations behind individuals drawn into the Proud Boys movement in the years leading up to January 6.

Rather than reducing people to stereotypes, Homegrown examines how community, belonging, grievance, and identity often drive political radicalization. Wilk and Michael unpack the role of outrage entrepreneurs, the public planning behind January 6, and why America’s deepest problem isn’t left vs. right—but toxic polarization itself.

This conversation challenges listeners to look beyond headlines and ask harder questions about how we got here—and where we go next.

The world is a better place if we are better people. That begins with each of us as individuals. Be kind to one another. Be grateful for all you’ve got. Make every day the day that you want it to be!

Please follow The Derate The Hate podcast on:

Facebook, Instagram, Twitter(X) , YouTube

Subscribe to us wherever you enjoy your audio or from our site. Please leave us a rating and feedback on Apple podcasts or other platforms. You can share your thoughts or request Wilk for a speaking engagement on our contact page: DerateTheHate.com/Contact

The Derate The Hate podcast is proudly produced in collaboration with Braver Angels — America’s largest grassroots, cross-partisan organization working toward civic renewal and bridging partisan divides. Learn more: BraverAngels.org

Welcome to the Derate The Hate Podcast!

*The views expressed by Wilk, his guest hosts &/or guests on the Derate The Hate podcast are their own and should not be attributed to any organization they may otherwise be affiliated with.

Send Wilk a text with your feedback! (incoming msgs only - I can't reply)

In this episode of Derate The Hate, Wilk sits down with Bill Woodson, founder of Conversations Across The Aisle, to explore what local bridge building looks like in a deeply polarized moment.

Bill shares the story behind launching the CATA Project, a community-based effort focused on respectful dialogue, shared humanity, and restoring civic trust—starting locally, with aspirations to grow nationally.

Together, Wilk and Bill discuss:

• Why toxic debate often shuts down understanding
• How polarization erodes hope and personal agency
• The power of safe, facilitated dialogue spaces
• Separating people from the positions they hold
• Why community-level efforts matter more than national shouting matches

This is a conversation about choosing courage over outrage—and building something better, one table at a time.

🔗 Learn more and connect with Bill Woodson by getting the full show notes at: www.DerateTheHate.com

The world is a better place if we are better people. That begins with each of us as individuals. Be kind to one another. Be grateful for all you’ve got. Make every day the day that you want it to be!

Please follow The Derate The Hate podcast on:

Facebook, Instagram, Twitter(X) , YouTube

Subscribe to us wherever you enjoy your audio or from our site. Please leave us a rating and feedback on Apple podcasts or other platforms. You can share your thoughts or request Wilk for a speaking engagement on our contact page: DerateTheHate.com/Contact

The Derate The Hate podcast is proudly produced in collaboration with Braver Angels — America’s largest grassroots, cross-partisan organization working toward civic renewal and bridging partisan divides. Learn more: BraverAngels.org

Welcome to the Derate The Hate Podcast!

*The views expressed by Wilk, his guest hosts &/or guests on the Derate The Hate podcast are their own and should not be attributed to any organization they may otherwise be affiliated with.

Send Wilk a text with your feedback! (incoming msgs only - I can't reply)

In this milestone 300th episode of Derate The Hate, Wilk Wilkinson is joined by Maury Giles, CEO of Braver Angels, for a wide-ranging conversation on toxic polarization, trust, and the responsibility of citizens in a divided America.

Maury shares his journey from a 35-year corporate career into full-time civic engagement, and why he believes courageous citizenship—not outrage or withdrawal—is the antidote to our current crisis.

Together, Wilk and Maury explore:

• Why polarization thrives when citizens give up agency
• The importance of red voices in the depolarization space
• How trust is rebuilt locally, not online
• Why disagreement is essential to a healthy constitutional republic
• What it means to renew the American pledge of shared responsibility

This episode marks not just a podcast milestone—but a call to action for citizens who still believe this country is worth the work.

The world is a better place if we are better people. That begins with each of us as individuals. Be kind to one another. Be grateful for all you’ve got. Make every day the day that you want it to be!

Please follow The Derate The Hate podcast on:

Facebook, Instagram, Twitter(X) , YouTube

Subscribe to us wherever you enjoy your audio or from our site. Please leave us a rating and feedback on Apple podcasts or other platforms. You can share your thoughts or request Wilk for a speaking engagement on our contact page: DerateTheHate.com/Contact

The Derate The Hate podcast is proudly produced in collaboration with Braver Angels — America’s largest grassroots, cross-partisan organization working toward civic renewal and bridging partisan divides. Learn more: BraverAngels.org

Welcome to the Derate The Hate Podcast!

*The views expressed by Wilk, his guest hosts &/or guests on the Derate The Hate podcast are their own and should not be attributed to any organization they may otherwise be affiliated with.

Send Wilk a text with your feedback! (incoming msgs only - I can't reply)

In Episode 299 of Derate The Hate, Wilk Wilkinson sits down with peacebuilder, author, and professor Chip Hauss to explore what it really takes to bridge divides in a polarized world.

Chip shares insights from his decades of work in conflict resolution and peacebuilding, including why addressing root causes matters more than fighting symptoms, and why meaningful change starts locally — not federally. Together, Wilk and Chip unpack common myths about political polarization, discuss the importance of personal agency and courageous citizenship, and explain how curiosity can transform conversations across difference.

This episode is grounded, hopeful, and deeply practical — a reminder that peacebuilding isn’t the work of elites, but something each of us can practice every day.

Topics Covered

• Peacebuilding as a daily practice
• Root-cause problem solving vs. symptom chasing
• Local action and community engagement
• Personal agency and courageous citizenship
• Finding joy in conversations across difference
• Lessons from Peace Building Starts at Home

Learn more about and connect with Chip Hauss in the full show notes at www.DerateTheHate.com.

The world is a better place if we are better people. That begins with each of us as individuals. Be kind to one another. Be grateful for all you’ve got. Make every day the day that you want it to be!

Please follow The Derate The Hate podcast on:

Facebook, Instagram, Twitter(X) , YouTube

Subscribe to us wherever you enjoy your audio or from our site. Please leave us a rating and feedback on Apple podcasts or other platforms. You can share your thoughts or request Wilk for a speaking engagement on our contact page: DerateTheHate.com/Contact

The Derate The Hate podcast is proudly produced in collaboration with Braver Angels — America’s largest grassroots, cross-partisan organization working toward civic renewal and bridging partisan divides. Learn more: BraverAngels.org

Welcome to the Derate The Hate Podcast!

*The views expressed by Wilk, his guest hosts &/or guests on the Derate The Hate podcast are their own and should not be attributed to any organization they may otherwise be affiliated with.