Episodios

  • The Beauty of Following the Church Calendar
    Dec 2 2025
    Dr. Nika Spaulding Dr. Kay Daigle Dr. Nika Spaulding joins Dr. Kay Daigle once again in this episode on the Church Calendar. If you are unaware of what that is, Nika will help you not only be informed, but also appreciate its beauty and how it can deepen your faith. We are now at the beginning of the church calendar year with the period of time leading up to the coming of Jesus, Advent. Other BOW Resources with Nika on the Church Calendar Why Celebrate Advent? and Why Celebrate Lent? Other resources Study from the Daily Grace Co. Easy Explainer for the calendar Great family devotional book on the calendar This episode is available on video as well. Timestamps: 00:32 Introduction to Nika and the church calendar 14:59 What is Pentecost? Why and how should be celebrate it in the church or even at home if our churches don't? 23:32 What is Ordinary Time? 27:12 So what? Why should we follow the church calendar? 32:34 Recommendations for someone leading in the church in any role 36:26 Resources on this topic TranscriptKay >> I'm Kay Daigle. Welcome to the Beyond Ordinary Women Podcast and video. Today, our guest is Nika Spaulding. Welcome, Nika. Nika >> Thank you. I'm excited to be here. Kay >> We're glad you're here. You know, I was looking at your bio. You sent us a new bio the other day, and it occurred to me that I never really asked you about having a zoology degree from the University of Oklahoma. What is that about? Nika >> Oh, so I will say I was originally pre-med. So while having a zoology degree is incredible, I originally thought I was going to go to med school. And O.U. weirdly doesn't have a biology program. They have a zoology program that feeds into a med school which is so strange because Oklahoma State has a biology program that feeds into a vet school. So it's not I don't know why we're you know, part of the reason why, though, I actually know the real reasons because we had world class scholars in that field at O.U. and we have world class research facilities, so they just kind of combine them. But even though I don't use my degree, I am utterly fascinated by the animal kingdom. And so it was a really fun degree for me to get. And it always surprises people when they find out that's my bachelor's degree. So I joke, though, with that degree, I'm not even qualified to like work at a zoo unless I'm in the gift shop. So I would have to go on to a lot more school. But, you know, there's always time if I decide to go that route. Kay >> Well, I love that. I wasn't sure if you started zoology because you just wanted to go in that direction and then God changed your mind or if there was something else behind it. Nika >> So it's definitely med school. And then to this day, I mean, even when I was a kid, if I saw blood, vomit, anything that doctors see on a routine basis, I get weak in the knees, I get sick to my stomach, I get all of these things. And I really was like, that's okay. I'm going to push through. And so I was on my way to the MCAT in college at O.U. and God was like, you really, you really don't get it, do you? And I finally was like, all right, Lord, what is it you would have me do? So took a hard left into theology. So I don't know anybody who has a zoology/theology degree other than me. I don't know anybody. And so, you know, but that's all right. Maybe there'll be more someday. Kay >> I don't know either. You're just unique. Probably in the whole world. Nika >> Sure. Well, it took me a while to figure out. I should probably follow God, so maybe I'm not unique in that way. I just went a weird route to that, but. Yeah. So it's fun, though. Kay >> Well, that's fun. Well, you also have a master of theology at DTS, and you have a DMin from Northern Seminary. So you have definitely made up for not having some sort of Bible degree, I suppose. Nika >> Yeah. Kay >> at O.U. So we are talking about the church calendar today,
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  • The Spiritual Practice of Hospitality
    Oct 21 2025
    Laura Murray Laura Murray joins Kay Daigle to discuss her book Becoming a Person of Welcome: The Spiritual Practice of Hospitality. She increases our understanding of what hospitality is, suggesting that it is more about relationships than spaces. Perhaps you've never felt comfortable with hosting others in your home. You may not have a space that's conducive to what you've considered hospitality. Laura's wise counsel and suggestions based on her own experiences will open your mind to new ways to practice Christian hospitality. Recommended resources laurabmurray.com provides a list Laura's digital silent retreats For the church: Becoming Communities of Belonging BOW's resources for You, As a Leader BOW's resources for Godly Living This episode is available on video as well. Timestamps: 00:21 Introductions 02:37 Why did you write about hospitality? 06:35 How do our thoughts of hospitality differ from the Scriptures? 10:10 Biblical hospitality takes the pressure off. 14:07 Is scriptural hospitality for everyone or only those with the gift of hospitality? 16:17 A word to those in ministry leadership 21:18 Spiritual practices for leaders 25:54 The book is a guidebook for spiritual practices & encouragement to persevere. 32:07 Spiritual practices in community & Laura's silent retreats 37:29 Recommended resources TranscriptKay >> Welcome to the Beyond Ordinary Women Podcast. I'm Kay Daigle. I'm your host today. And today we are talking with our guest, Laura Murray. Welcome, Laura. Laura >> Thanks for having me. Kay >> Oh, we're so excited that you're here. Laura is a pastor. She is an author. She's a spiritual director. She is the Director of Spiritual Engagement and Innovation at Fuller Seminary's Center for Spiritual Formation. That's kind of a long title. Laura >> It is long. Kay >> She is a retreat creator. And we'll mention that at the end as well, that she just has been doing many things. She has a lot of experience in the church and as a spiritual director. And so we're just delighted that you were able to be with us. You can find out more about Laura on our website. If you just go to the top menu and go to About Us and look at the Video/Podcast Contributors, and we will have more information about Laura and how you can get in touch with her. So we are talking today from your book Becoming a Person of Welcome: The Spiritual Practice of Hospitality. And I have to say that I was just really interested in that title when I saw it online somewhere that your book was going to be coming out and the spiritual practice of hospitality just really intrigued me as I read about that. And so tell us a little bit about it. We're not talking about just hospitality where are you having people over to your house, Laura >> Right. Kay >> This encompasses way beyond that, and I'm sure you picked that up as we go through. We're not going to tell you how to set your table. We're not going to tell you how to manage your menu or anything like that. We're going to talk about spiritual hospitality. So, Laura, just tell us where this idea of writing about hospitality begin. Laura >> Yeah, thanks for that question. And I was talking to somebody about this the other day, said, why did you decide to write on hospitality? And I thought, I think it found me. I didn't go searching for it. It found me. I was in the middle of my doctoral studies and the pandemic hit and shelter in place hit. And I didn't necessarily have a context for my studies. When you're doing a doctoral study, you have to have a context. And I had just stepped away from a role of pastoral ministry in a church and I found myself really struggling in my relationship with God because those anchors weren't there anymore. Like the anchors of worship or the anchors of gathering together, those things weren't there anymore. So I thought, if I'm struggling being with God,
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  • Soul Thirst
    Nov 18 2025
    Gwynne Johnson Kelly Arabie Gwynne Johnson and Kelly Arabie, authors of Soul Thirst: Discerning Your Divine Design, explain how seeking to fulfill our needs in the wrong places harms us and our relationships. They provide a roadmap to enable women to recognize what they are thirsting for in place of the only one who can provide true satisfaction. God alone quenches our soul thirst. This book is a blend of accessible story and biblical life principles that have transformed women around the world as they come to understand God’s design for the human heart. You can also watch this episode on video. Resources: Soul Thirst: Discerning Your Divine Design Website: www.soulthirst.net Podcast Embrace Your Life--a conversation with author Elizabeth Woodson Reimagining Discipleship: A Kingdom Perspective with Kay Daigle & Sharifa Stevens Timestamps: 00:20 Introductions 02:40 Writing Soul Thirst 011:58 What is soul thirst and how does it affect us? 14:55 Thirst, mind, will and emotions are involved 16:10 Thirsts common to many women 18:39 How to best use soul thirst 19:50 A template for thinking about life 22:56 Final words of encouragement TranscriptKay >> Hi. I'm Kay Daigle of Beyond Ordinary Women Ministries. I'm so excited to welcome you to this episode of our podcast and it’s also on video. We are just delighted to have you joining us, and I'm thrilled with our two guests today—Gwynne Johnson, Kelly Arabie. I've known both of them for many years now, and I consider them good friends of mine. Kelly and I actually met at D.T.S., where we were both starting DTS, I think the same semester and went through the same program. Definitely. So I got to know Kelly really well there. And Gwynne and I have crossed paths in many situations. We've been on a couple of boards together, so we've worked together on things. And I really have respected all of her ministry that she has done through the years. If you want to know more about Gwynne and Kelly and their backgrounds, go to our website BeyondOrdinaryWomen.org, and go to the pull down menu that is About Us. And look at Video Podcast Contributors. And you can read more about them, although I think they will probably talk some about some of their experiences as we go through this conversation today. So thank you both for coming. Welcome on our podcast. Gwynne >> Fun to be with you. Kelly >> Yes, thanks for having us. Kay >> Thank you. And you know, I did want to mention Gwynne and I are part of a group of women, and I just want to mention that because to me it's been such a helpful group, all of us who had been involved in ministry for years and we started gathering somebody invited us to gather together at Christmas and we so we started having Christmas luncheons together and we just became good friends and we pray for one another. We support one another and encourage one another and challenge one another. And it's been a great encouragement. So for those of you out there, you don't even have to be leaders, but everybody needs a group like that. So I just wanted to throw that in there too. Today we're talking about Gwynne and Kelly's book Soul Thirst that they co-wrote. And first, I just really kind of wanted to ask Kelly, what was it like to co-write this? How was your process here? Is it hard to do two people doing different things? Kelly >> You know, it was really fun. And I would say being able to collaborate with Gwynne and the conversations that we've had over the years were just such a blessing and a gift. It was a gift that Gwynne invited me to this project. And I'm sure she's going to talk a little bit about, you know, how this started with her ministry. But in 2008 was one of the first times that I think I went through Developing a Discerning Heart. And as part of that, Gwynne came and spoke to our small group, and we just talked about the study and how amazing it had been.
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  • Women Imprisoned for Their Faith
    Nov 4 2025
    Dr. Nijay Gupta Dr. Kelley Mathews Dr. Nijay Gupta, author of Tell Her Story, joins BOW Team Member Kelley Mathews in this fascinating discussion of persecuted women in the early church. What can we learn from their stories? How do their stories encourage our faith and our own courage? What can we learn from them? What do we miss when we fail to study them? These women's stories provide models for us today to stand up for Christ, to know that he is better than anything that comes into our lives, and to be willing to cling to him no matter what happens to us or our country in the future. Recommended resources By Dr. Gupta Tell Her Story: How Women Led, Taught, and Ministered in the Early Church Redeeming Eden: How Women in the Bible Advance the Story of Salvation by Ingrid Faro and Joyce Koo Dalrymple nijaykgupta.substack.com Christianity Today article by Dr. Gupta, "Junia, the Female Apostle Imprisoned for the Gospel" This episode is available on video if you prefer watching. Timestamps: 00:22 Introductions 01:40 Junia (Romans 16:7) and the conditions in Roman prisons, especially for women 13:25 What egregious activities would put a woman in prison? 17:17 Perpetua, whose diary provides great information about imprisonment, and Felicity, her slave girl 28:31 Blandina's story 29:30 Physical suffering in the Scriptures 37:26 Other resources TranscriptKelley >> Welcome to the Beyond Ordinary Women Podcast. I'm your host Kelley Mathews. And today I have with me Dr. Nijay Gupta. He is a professor at Northern Seminary and a prolific author. Welcome, Nijay. Dr. Gupta >> Hi, Kelley. Looking forward to our conversation. Kelley >> So this is going to be fun, I think. I mean, well, fun. That's relative, I guess. But it'll be intriguing I think. Nijay has written a lot of books. He's been a professor for a while. A lot of his books have to do with Paul and the New Testament letters that he wrote. But he's also written one particular book that is specific to our topic today, and it is called Tell Her Story came out a couple of years ago, and it basically tells about the women in the New Testament who were really involved in leading and participating in the mission of the church. So it has become quite popular, from what I understand. I certainly enjoyed it. Dr. Gupta >> Yes, thank you. Yeah, it's funny. I, you know, just had an idea to write this book, and I sent it to an editor friend of mine, Anna Gissing, and she was so excited. And then it just sort of took off from there. So a big thank you to Intervarsity Press for publishing it. Kelley >> Oh, they're great. So one of the women in that book we're going to start with. Our topic today is specific, not that broad of women involved in the church, but specifically ones who were imprisoned for their faith. And one of the women you cover in the book does hold that honor, I suppose. And we're also going to talk about one who is post biblical days who are still in the early church and maybe will hit a third one. So, Nijay, tell us who Junia is and why we need to know about her. Dr. Gupta >> Yeah. A lot of my work on this subject owes a debt to Romans 16, which is the last chapter of Paul's big letter to the Romans. And I used to think of Romans 16 as a bunch of kind of hellos that Paul gives at the end of the letter, almost like end credits in a movie. And you sort of get up, you don't pay attention. You leave the movie theater. And so I had a friend in seminary who actually memorized the whole book of Romans, and he asked me, how should I memorize Roman 16? And I said, You're at the end. Just finish it off. But there's that sense of you're preaching through Romans. You kind of, you know, have so much to work with. Just in the first four chapters, let alone get to chapter 11, let alone if you get to chapter 15 that I don't know if I hear from any very many sermons on Romans 16.
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  • Women & Worship in the Early Church
    Oct 7 2025
    Dr. Sandra Glahn Dr. Kelley Mathews Dr. Sandra Glahn, Professor at Dallas Seminary, joins BOW Team Member Kelley Mathews in this episode. They discuss the fascinating archaeological discovery of the Megiddo Mosaic and what it reveals about women and worship in the early church. The Mosaic was found in what is the earliest Christian church known in the world This Mosaic is currently on loan and can be seen at the Museum of the Bible in Washington, D.C. Other resources: See pictures of the Megiddo Mosaic at the website of The Museum of the Bible. BOW's podcast series on how Biblical archaeology can enhance our faith with Angela Everett: 1. Biblical Archaeology: Why It Is Important; 2. Old Testament Discoveries; 3. New Testament Discoveries. Or link to the videos of each where you can see images of the archaeological finds: Part 1; Part 2: and Part 3. This episode is available on video as well. Timestamps: 00:20 Introductions of Dr. Glahn & the topic 02:23 What is the visual record of the church and why is it important? 06:18 Background of the Visual Museum of Women in Christianity 07:52 What was the archaeological find at Megiddo? And what does it tell us about the early Christian church? And particularly women? 14:27 The most significant thing about the mosaic itself 20:45 The incorrect and better narratives as to why there were so many women the early church 24:05 Display at the Museum of the Bible [Note: If you are interested, check to see if the Mosaic is still on display.] 24:35 Why was the Mosaic covered? 25:24 The deity of Christ 26:59 Where to see images of the mosaic TranscriptKelley >> Welcome to the Beyond Ordinary Women Podcast. I'm Kelley Mathews and I am delighted today to host Dr. Sandra Glahn, a longtime friend and colleague. And she's a seminary professor. But today we're going to talk to her in her context of being the co-founder of the Visual Museum of Women in Christianity. Welcome. Dr. Glahn >> Thank you. My pleasure. Kelley >> This is fun. Yeah. So today we're going to talk about something old, really old. And archaeology is a big part of biblical studies that gives us lots of background. And there have been some discoveries in recent years that really apply to women in particular. So tell us what we all heard of the Dead Sea Scrolls or most of us probably. And those were discovered decades ago and they've really revealed a lot. What are people saying is the biggest discovery since then? Dr. Glahn >> Since then. So it's a floor that was found in Megiddo, which is connected with Armageddon. That's where you hear the "magid" in there. So it's not just notorious. It's also known for some great stuff in church history and in biblical history. And some folks were digging in a prison courtyard and came upon a preserved floor that's a beautiful stone mosaic. And the thing I love about mosaics is they can look like they were set yesterday, whereas a fresco fades, a statue usually in 2000 years, loses a nose or an arm, or archer loses a bow or whatever. But the mosaics are much more preserved. And this floor was intentionally preserved. So it was clear that it was hidden for a reason, but it was intended to hide it for a long lasting preservation. So it wasn't just covered over with sand and dirt as the years went by, it was more like a plaster-ish substance that said, “We want to protect this, but we want to hide it.” So I should probably back up and tell you what in the world I do. I'm a seminary professor who mostly teach writing and all those hard verses about women in the Bible. What do I have to do with archaeology? And because that will be relevant in what we talk about. So one of the courses I teach at a seminary level is medieval art and spirituality. And we take men and women to Italy for about 17 to 19 days every other summer and look at the visual record of the church. That is particularly relevant for women because often when we teach church h...
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  • Making the Complex Simple
    Sep 23 2025
    Dr. Nika Spaulding Dr. Kay Daigle Dr. Nika Spaulding makes the complex simple for everyday people. In this episode she joins Dr. Kay Daigle to discuss the first booklet in her series Theology in 10. Her purpose is to help us all easily understand theological issues. Her first booklet tackles the topic of the Trinity. It's hard to grasp, but Nika finds a way to simplify it so that all believers not only understand it but also apply this truth in real life. Don't miss Nika's easy explanation of the series and this topic. If you want to dig deeper into understanding the Trinity, consider ordering one of the resources that Nika suggests below. Resources: Theology in 10 at nikaspaulding.com Delighting in the Trinity: An Introduction to the Christian Faith by Michael Reeves The Deep Things of God: How the Trinity Changes Everything by Fred Sanders Trinity songs playlist Other topics with Nika: Series on justice Series on lament Series on Choosing Trustworthy Resources Trinity songs playlist This episode is available on video as well. Timestamps: 00:20 Introductions 01:35 How Nika got into theology 04:15 The desire to make theology simple for everyone 06:13 Nika's project to make theology accessible in 10 09:45 Elements included in 10 pages 11:47 Goals for the reader 13:31 Why start with the Trinity? 16:03 What are the "So Whats" from the Trinity? 31:54 How to get Theology in 10 32:18 Other resources 33:04 Nika's Closing comments on God's love for us--that all members of the Trinity love and save us. TranscriptKay >> Hi. I'm Kay Daigle of Beyond Ordinary Women Ministries. I'm here today with Nika Spaulding. Welcome, Nika. Nika >> Thanks, Kay. Kay >> And welcome to all of you out there. We're so glad that you joined us for this conversation. We're going to be talking about theology for everyday people. And let me tell you just a little bit about Nika, why she is an expert in theology. She has a DMin in New Testament. And she also has a master's of theology from DTS. And she is a storyteller and a theologian. And I've heard her described herself as actually a Bible nerd. Nika >> That's so true. Yeah. Kay >> So those are things that I know about Nika. And she has been working on a new project, Theology in 10. I'll let her tell you about that. But it is that theology for everyday people that she has come up with. And so I really want to talk about all those things. And I could but first, I really thought, particularly since we're talking about you as the theologian and theology, that maybe some people don't know anything really about you. So tell us a little bit about your background and why you got into theology in the first place. Nika >> Yeah, it's such a good question. So I didn't grow up in the church, so the fact that I'm like now a Doctor of Ministry in the New Testament is like more shocking maybe to me than anyone. So I actually have a science background. I grew up in a non-Christian home. My parents are believers now. I grew up in a great home. I loved my family. But theology was this really foreign thing to me! This like I knew that books existed. I knew that theology was like a discipline, like zoology, which is my bachelor's degree or like psychology or all of these things. But I got to college and I thought for sure I was going to be a doctor because I love science and I wanted to help people. But to this day, if I see blood or vomit, I get weak in the knees and I pass out like till this day. And I knew this even going into college. So. Oh, yeah, everybody with common sense kept going “Maybe you should pick a different career,” but I didn't have enough common sense at 18. So eventually I realized, Okay, I'm not going to make it through medical school. So now what? And that started me on a journey of trying to figure out what is it that God was calling me to do. At that point, I was walking with the Lord faithfully.
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  • Questions about Prayer
    Sep 9 2025
    Kay Daigle Claudia McGuire Most if not all of us have had questions about prayer at some point in our lives. Perhaps yours were never answered or the answers you heard didn't satisfy your curiosity. If so, this episode is for you. BOW Ministry Team Member Claudia McGuire is here to help. Don't miss her insightful and helpful conversation with Kay Daigle. This episode is also available on video. Other resources on prayer “Practical Prayer Solutions” with Kay Daigle & Kelly Arabie “Prayer & Obedience” with Claudia McGuire Book: Prayer: How to Have a Conversation with God by Rosalind Rinker Timestamps: 00:21 Introductions 02:01 Prayer is hard for many reasons. 04:23 Why pray? 08:27 Is there a right or wrong way to pray? 11:34 Why did the disciples ask Jesus how to pray? 16:01 Why are my prayers not answered? 21:33 What role does faith play in prayer? 27:20 What is intercessory prayer? 31:02 Is there a prayer that God doesn't answer? 34:51 Does Jesus pray for us? 38:28 Do we need to work hard to be heard? 48:25 Other prayer resources TranscriptKay >> Hi. I am Kay Daigle. I'd like to welcome you to this episode of the Beyond Ordinary Women Podcast. Today I'm talking with Claudia McGuire. Welcome, Claudia. Claudia >> Thank you. Kay >> Claudia spent years on staff at a church in Plano, Texas, at Chase Oaks, and she now still does Bible teaching, and she speaks at retreats, leadership, training, conferences—whatever. And we are so glad that she is one of our BOW Ministry Team members. So she's not really a guest, but she is a co-worker in this ministry. And it's been a privilege to know Claudia since we were in seminary together. Claudia >> Thank you. You, too. I feel the same. Kay >> Yes. So today we're going to talk about prayer. We've talked about prayer previously, and we're going to talk a little bit about prayer today. We're going to talk about your Prayer Questions Answered. So if you have had a question, possibly Claudia will answer that question today because I think she's come up with some general questions that a lot of people ask. Is that right, Claudia? Claudia >> I think so. I've heard these questions. And then I've also just thought through these seem like logical questions to me. Some of them are kind of seem harder than others, but I think they're all relevant. Right? Kay >> Right. I totally agree. Claudia >> So I just have observed that over the years, as I've been in Bible study or led Bible study or been in small groups, or mission groups or, you know, all kinds of situations like that with I should say, fellow Christians, fellow Christ followers, I've just observed that there are people who seem to be uncomfortable with praying, right? Kay >> Yes. Claudia >> So just praying, just uncomfortable with it. Even if maybe they've been a part of your group for quite a while. Or even if maybe they've known the Lord for quite a while, there's this uncomfortable thing that happens. And, you know, not to call on them when it's prayer time and whatever situation you're in. Some don't like to pray aloud. I'm not saying that they don't pray. That some don't like to pray aloud. They just don't like that. Kay >> Yep. Claudia >> And some people are uncomfortable when other people pray. Like, I just kind of sense that sometimes from people. And then some others don't. We kind of touched on this in another recording that we did, but some others don't want to share requests because they feel God's not going to hear me, this isn't worth his time. Nobody wants to hear this or it's just something that I'm not ready to put out there before people, which is I understand that. So maybe we can address some of this mystery that seems to surround prayer or at least have a discussion of things that might keep us from praying in all kinds of situations. And hopefully as a result of this, that we who pray out loud or don't have a problem with prayer might disc...
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  • Leaders, Seek Volunteers More Gifted than You
    Aug 26 2025
    Kat Armstrong Kay Daigle Leaders are always on the hunt for good volunteers. The question is what to look for in a potential volunteer. The answer? Recruit gifted volunteers. In fact, look for those more gifted than you are. What does it look like practically? Kat Armstrong discusses with Kay Daigle why and how to find and empower such volunteers. As a leader, this episode will make you think about what gifts you need in the people working under and with you. Keep in mind that you need to recruit gifted volunteers, people who are even more gifted than you are! Recommended resources Recruit the right volunteers with Kat Armstrong How Should I Structure My Women's Ministry Team? Maximizing volunteers This episode is available on video as well. TranscriptKay >> Hi, I'm Kay Daigle with Beyond Ordinary Women, and I am delighted to welcome you to a series of videos that I'm doing with Kat Armstrong, who is the founder of Polished Ministry, a nonprofit. And Kat is sharing lessons in leadership that she has learned through leading in Polished. And we have some others that we're discussing as well. But this particular session we're going to talk about seeking leaders that are more gifted than you. And so, Kat, there are probably people out there wondering why in the world you would want to seek leaders more gifted than you, because don't you want to sort of be the one who knows all the answers and, you know, you're sort of at the top of the food chain. Why not? Kat >> Well, yes, I used to think that way. I read this book by John Maxwell, probably 15 years ago called Developing the Leaders Around You. And that book changed my mind about this. And he said, “Think about your leadership on a scale with zero being not such a great leader, got to work on some things, and ten being really high capacity person. He said, “Let's say that we're seven maybe six-and-a-half. If you start recruiting eight, nines and tens in your organization, they're going to bring you up. They're only going to encourage you in leadership and make you a better leader. And I think Stephanie and I, when we co-founded this organization, really took that to heart. But I started to see quickly that if we were going to reach our peers with the gospel—young, professional women (I only had experience in sales and marketing), we needed women who were great in accounting and logistics and administration and technology. Things that I'm not going to be able to learn really quickly or efficiently. But they know how to do it. And so we just decided let's recruit the smartest, fastest, most efficient women we can think of. And it is a little intimidating. I walk into a leadership team meeting, and I think everyone in here is better educated and could do a lot of things better than I can. But it just makes our team really strong. Kay >> Absolutely. I totally agree with you about that. Do you have an example to share of someone or a group that really was just an amazing recruit? Kat >> Sure. If we look at our staff right now, I wish I could talk about all of them. We don't have time to do that. But I think if you just go to our website, look at the headquarters staff, they're incredible. Felicia Benton really stands out in my mind is someone I watched behind a microphone and I thought, wow, she is better at interviewing than I have gotten in a decade. And I've really been practicing. We've done over 200 events. I bet I've interviewed a slew of people and it was like magic to watch her behind a microphone. And then I watched her emcee an event, and I thought of all the things I've read in the training I've been to that is just raw, natural talent right there. It's and now she's joined our staff as the regional director, and she helps all of our directors and see and speak. And so she's training people on how to do that. But I think she probably stands out as a great example for that. Kay >> Well,
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