Sharing the gospel with Catholics is an act of love because God loves them deeply. In this episode, Ray, E.Z., Mark, and Oscar delve into the implications of Catholic teachings on the role of the Pope and its significance for the Gospel. The Pope is the head of the Catholic Church, but Scripture makes it clear: Christ alone is the head of the Church, which consists of true believers. While the Catholic Church has played a significant role in preserving God’s word and has done much good worth recognizing, there are serious concerns regarding salvation.

The Catholic Church has always taught faith, but not salvation by grace alone. The idea that grace follows all you can do stands in direct tension with the biblical message of imputed righteousness. Christ’s righteousness is credited to believers, not earned through merit. The guys make it clear they are not claiming there are no saved Catholics, but that salvation would be despite official Church teaching, not because of it. Oscar challenges the belief that Peter was the first pope, arguing that the early church resembled a presbytery, where multiple bishops served collectively. Historical evidence shows that the title and authority of the pope developed over time. Even papal infallibility was not formally declared until the 1800s and remains a topic of controversy among Catholics.

A central concern is the tendency to elevate tradition above scripture. The guys urge believers to let the Bible speak clearly. William Tindale gave his life to make scripture accessible, and it remains the most effective tool in gospel conversations. Matthew 16 refers to the truth that Jesus is the Christ as the rock, not Peter himself. Peter was important, but not preeminent. He referred to all believers as a royal priesthood. Reassigning that identity to a single man misrepresents the biblical narrative.

The guys also discuss doctrines that have been added over time, such as purgatory, the veneration of saints, and praying to the dead. These practices shift attention away from Christ. There is one mediator between God and man, and that is Jesus. Ray shares that many Catholics know Jesus died for their sins but cannot explain what that means for their salvation. He has found that they are often open and willing to engage in a deep way. Rather than argue, he focuses on walking them through the gospel and lets God work. Scripture remains the authority. The church is built on Christ, not Peter. Grace is God’s unmerited favor to the undeserving. Compassion must not lead to compromise. The gospel is simple, powerful, and straightforward. Christ alone is the head of the Church.

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Thanks for listening! If you’ve been helped by this podcast, we’d be grateful if you’d consider subscribing, sharing, and leaving us a comment and 5-star rating!

Visit the Living Waters website to learn more and to access helpful resources!
You can find helpful counseling resources at biblicalcounseling.com.
Check out The Evidence Study Bible and the Basic Training Course.

You can connect with us at podcast@livingwaters.com. We're thankful for your input!
Learn more about the hosts of this podcast.
Ray Comfort
Emeal (“E.Z.”) Zwayne
Mark Spence
Oscar Navarro

This episode addresses the crucial question: Was Peter truly the first pope? The conversation centers on how Catholic claims about papal authority compare to both scripture and early church history. Ray, E.Z., Mark, and Oscar walk through the biblical foundation for church leadership, pointing out that the early church operated more like a group of regional bishops working together, rather than under a single central figure. They explain how, over time, as Rome gained political and religious influence, the bishop of Rome came to be seen as preeminent—a development not rooted in scripture but in historical circumstance. The guys also address related doctrines, such as papal infallibility, which was not formally defined until the 1800s and remains debated even among Catholics. Test all traditions against scripture, which consistently affirms that Christ, not Peter or any other man, is the true and only head of the Church.

Send us a text

Thanks for listening! If you’ve been helped by this podcast, we’d be grateful if you’d consider subscribing, sharing, and leaving us a comment and 5-star rating!

Visit the Living Waters website to learn more and to access helpful resources!
You can find helpful counseling resources at biblicalcounseling.com.
Check out The Evidence Study Bible and the Basic Training Course.

You can connect with us at podcast@livingwaters.com. We're thankful for your input!
Learn more about the hosts of this podcast.
Ray Comfort
Emeal (“E.Z.”) Zwayne
Mark Spence
Oscar Navarro

Ray, E.Z., Mark, and Oscar are joined by Dr. Greg Gifford, Assistant Professor of Biblical Counseling at The Master’s University and author of a new book that challenges the roots of modern psychology from a biblical perspective. As a counselor, Greg has noticed oddities in therapy methods that often fail to address the root of the issue for Christians. Instead of demonizing individuals or dismissing therapy completely, Greg encourages believers to explore how psychology and psychiatry differ, what Scripture says about the mind and soul, and how biblical counseling provides a Christ-centered alternative to mainstream therapeutic practices.

Biblical counseling views the Bible as the ultimate authority, contrasting with secular therapy that places the self as the highest truth. A key issue raised is the confusion between mind and brain. The mind is connected to the inner person—the heart, thoughts, and soul—while the brain is part of the physical body. Using medication to treat the brain may relieve symptoms, but if no physical cause is identified, the believer should be open to spiritual self-examination and repentance. Greg urges listeners to seek out certified biblical counselors who base their guidance on the authority of God’s Word. Red flags in counseling include seeking advice from those who do not share a biblical worldview, as they could mislead rather than direct toward Christ.

E.Z. raises the topic of shame, which is often avoided in today’s culture but is understood biblically as a way to guide one toward repentance. The aim is not to remove shame entirely but to let it serve its purpose in the process of confession, repentance, and restoration. Greg’s nuanced perspective recognizes that people can suffer deeply but challenges the modern labeling of it as a disease of the mind. Understanding the difference between brain and mind is essential. Christians are encouraged to consider whether their reliance on medication is covering up deeper spiritual needs. The Bible addresses restlessness, identity, and suffering, offering hope and healing that secular therapy cannot provide.

Toward the end, Mark asks a bold question about the blind spots in biblical counseling. Greg responds by urging the church to focus not only on critiquing secular approaches but also on addressing the root causes of issues. The conversation ends with a reminder that Christians are not defined by their diagnoses or struggles—they are defined by Christ. Greg encourages listeners to be skeptical not of truth but of man-centered approaches that fail to rely on the sufficiency of Scripture.

Send us a text

Thanks for listening! If you’ve been helped by this podcast, we’d be grateful if you’d consider subscribing, sharing, and leaving us a comment and 5-star rating!

Visit the Living Waters website to learn more and to access helpful resources!
You can find helpful counseling resources at biblicalcounseling.com.
Check out The Evidence Study Bible and the Basic Training Course.

You can connect with us at podcast@livingwaters.com. We're thankful for your input!
Learn more about the hosts of this podcast.
Ray Comfort
Emeal (“E.Z.”) Zwayne
Mark Spence
Oscar Navarro