In this academic-themed interview episode of Decoding the Gurus, Matt and Chris sit down to chat with Dorsa Amir and Chaz Firestone (@chazfirestone) about their recent paper 'Is Visual Perception WEIRD? The Müller-Lyer Illusion and the Cultural Byproduct Hypothesis.'

In a conversation that serves as a welcome tonic to the endless lamentations of the gurus about academic groupthink and closed-minded silos, Dorsa and Chaz discuss the interdisciplinary nature of their work, debates around universal vs. culturally specific psychology, and the strength of evidence that visual perception varies between cultures.

We also learn about the dangers of being STUPID: Studying Topics Uninformed by Prior Investigations in the Discipline, and attempt to uncover just how much Chaz enjoys popping balloons.

A fun one that might even leave you a little bit more optimistic than usual!

Links

• Amir, D., & Firestone, C. (2025). Is visual perception WEIRD? The Müller-Lyer illusion and the cultural byproduct hypothesis. Psychological Review.
• Dorsa's Homepage and Mind and Culture Lab.
• Chaz's Perception & Mind Lab Homepage, his instagram, and his BJJ victory video.
• Decoding Academia 33: The Great Müller-Lyer Debate from Fish Tanks to Eye Operations
• Mickey Inzlicht's Substack on the Paper and the Debates around it.
• Henrich, J., Heine, S. J., & Norenzayan, A. (2010). The weirdest people in the world?. Behavioral and brain sciences, 33(2-3), 61-83.
• Lucca, K., Yuen, F., Wang, Y., Alessandroni, N., Allison, O., Alvarez, M., ... & Hamlin, J. K. (2025). Infants’ Social Evaluation of Helpers and Hinderers: A Large‐Scale, Multi‐Lab, Coordinated Replication Study. Developmental Science, 28(1), e13581.

We wallow in the mud with some of the worst gurus of the gurusphere. Join us and lament the guru paradise that we all live in.

Supplementary Material 32

00:00 Introduction and Banter

01:22 Old Squeaky and Daily Life

03:53 Matthew McConaughey Episode Recap

08:13 The Liver King Controversy

16:14 Nazi Propaganda on YouTube

21:11 Historical Revisionism: Darryl Cooper and David Irving

27:46 Huberman's very public hardcore research

32:25 Huberman sells out

34:32 Chris Langan: The Bottom (Racist) Tier of Gurudom

36:03 Langan on Weinstein

42:21 Langan's grievances against Elon Musk and Jordan Peterson

49:47 Matt Goodwin visits London

55:59 Gary Stevenson hates Graphs and Data

01:10:33 Gary compares himself to Russell Brand

01:15:12 THEY won't let you talk about the economy

01:17:22 Matt invokes Goodwin's Law

01:25:08 The All In Podcast Besties launch a Tequila Brand

01:28:32 Matt's Modest Utopian Plan

01:31:12 Lab Leak Discourse continues at the Guardian

01:35:55 Matt attacks the Mainstream Media

01:39:11 Dugin's Forum of the Future 2050 and the Guru Horseshoe

01:45:57 Extended Outro

The full episode is available for Patreon subscribers (1hr 50 mins).

Join us at: https://www.patreon.com/DecodingTheGurus

Sources

• 2Lazy2Try: The Liver King Gets Arrested For Trying To Hunt Down Joe Rogan
• Rob Mohr tweets out an iconic photo of Huberman
• Scott Carney: Documenting Andrew Huberman's Lies
• Chris Langan's thoughts on Eric Weinstein
• Chris Langan's thoughts on Elon Musk & Jordan Peterson
• Matt Goodwin's visit to London
• Despolarisa: #89 GARY STEVENSON - Economics, Trading, Inequality, Wealth, Populism, Tax, Depolarize
• The All-In Podcast guys being bastards
• Tsargard Institute: The Forum for the Future 2050

In this episode, Matt and Chris try to get from where they are to where they want to be, accepting their hidden strengths and dismantling their egos as they immerse themselves fully in the wild world of Matthew McConaughey's burgeoning self-help empire. Join them as they uncover the true Art of Livin’ and learn how it is that an Academy Award-winning Hollywood star finds himself sharing life advice alongside the likes of Tony Robbins and Dean Graziosi.

With bongos, heartfelt confessions, and a sales pitch that'll make your wallet quiver, we break down the one-and-only event where journaling and wet dreams are your ticket to self-actualisation. Brace yourself for some heavy-duty motivational speeches, meaningful shared stories, and just a pinch of canned audience responses, as we ride shotgun on this once-in-a-lifetime self-help seminar.

And how much will all this cost you? You ask? It should be $3000, but for today only, we give it all for free.

Links

• McConaughey's segment from the The Art of Livin' Event
• KeyasWorld: Matthew McConaughey's self-help event WAS INSANE
• KeyasWorld: Is Matthew McConaughey Starting a Cult?
• Rolling Stone: Matthew McConaughey Will Dispense ‘Lyrics of Livin’ in New Weekly Newsletter
• The Monastery in the Desert
• Mikhaila Peterson: #32 Matthew McConaughey
• Lex Fridman: Matthew McConaughey: Freedom, Truth, Family, Hardship, and Love | Lex Fridman Podcast #384

Welcome to another enlightening episode of Decoding Academia. In this bonus preview of our highly secretive Patreon content, we are discussing a controversial paper by Dorsa Amir and Chaz Firestone that challenges the established notion of the Müller-Lyer illusion being a product of cultural environments.

Prepare yourself for some high-level discussions of the visual processes of guppy fish and bearded lizards, as well as the remarkable lengths that psychologists will go to in order to get people to complete their tests. Will our seasoned scholars unravel the illusion, or is this debate another eye-catching mirage?

Sources

• (forthcoming) Amir, D., & Firestone, C. Is visual perception WEIRD? The Müller-Lyer illusion and the Cultural Byproduct Hypothesis. Psychological Review.
• Dorsa's summary thread on the paper
• Joe Henrich's critical thread on the paper
• Chaz's response to the Joe Henrich thread
• Paul Bloom's Substack articles on Nature vs. Nurture debates and clever experiments

We venture into the darker corners of the gurusphere and marvel at some very, very brave individuals, their valiant efforts to play devil's advocate, and some world-class discourse surfing skills. Join us, won't you?

Supplementary Material 31: Aquatic Nightmares, Strategic Obliviousness, & Race Realists

00:00 Introduction & Ol Squeaky Cameo

02:57 Matt's Aquarium Trauma & Stress Dreams

09:45 RFK Jr's war on science continues

11:17 Robert Malone & other 'Covid Contrarians' rewarded under Trump

14:35 The LA Protests, Riots, and Anti-Immigrant Narratives

20:12 Flint Dibble calls out Joe Rogan

25:24 Joe Rogan is a polemical ideologue and anti-vaccine advocate

27:34 Cassandra Kavanagh?

32:37 If Books Could Kill on Lab Leak

35:10 Popular Perceptions of the Covid Pandemic vs Reality

38:38 Debating COVID-19 Measures

38:59 Clarifying the Role of Sam's Manager

42:56 Discussing Trump, Musk, and DOGE's Political Impact

47:12 The Meaning Crisis and the Comfort of Religion

50:35 The Effects of Social Media

53:15 Matt and Chris Friendly Shadowboxing

56:19 The horror of directly stating your opinions

58:14 Sam Harris' Preparation for Conversations

01:05:02 Strategic Obliviousness

01:12:26 A little bit of TRT Discourse

01:16:17 Lex's Insufferable Tweet:  Celebrating Humanity and Responding to Critics

01:18:46 The Bravery of the All In Podcast Besties

01:20:33 Elon Musk and Donald Trump: A Complex Relationship

01:23:42 Mike from PA and Dunking Safely Online

01:26:10 Scientific Racism and Controversial Podcasts

01:34:02 Paul Bloom and Subjective Redlines

01:41:10 The Neo-Nazi Smoke in the Race Realism World

01:48:36 Daniël Lakens on Bryan Johnson on Mortality Salience

01:50:16 Matt's Foodie Corner

01:52:21 Outro

The full episode is available for Patreon subscribers (1hr 54 mins).

Join us at: https://www.patreon.com/DecodingTheGurus

Sources

• BBC- RFK Jr appoints new US vaccine advisers after sacking committee
• Flint Dibble’s New Video: Joe Rogan's Cult of Fake Archaeology
• Lex Fridman’s Insufferable Tweet
• Sam Harris EPISODE 419 "More From Sam": Elon vs. Trump, Religion, Jordan Peterson, & Rapid Fire Questions
• The All In Besties being cowards
• The Guardian: Harvard author Steven Pinker appears on podcast linked to scientific racism
• Steven Pinker on Aporia
• Hope Not Hate’s investigation into Aporia and related race science networks
• If Books Could Kill: The Lab Leak Goes Mainstream

The Decoders welcome back cognitive anthropologist Manvir Singh for a continued exploration into the social and cognitive dimensions of shamanism. Building upon their earlier conversation, this episode involves further discussion of the psychological mechanisms and cultural patterns that make shamanic practices a recurring feature across human societies. Drawing from Singh's latest book, Shamanism: The Timeless Religion (2025), the discussion addresses how these ancient practices persist and adapt in modern contexts.

Taking our standard meandering conversational journey with Manvir, we traverse topics such as whether Jesus and the Buddha were shamans, the parallels between the Siberian tundra and Silicon Valley, the potential emergence of AI-driven shamans within virtual reality environments, and whether dialogos with Hermes counts as a soul flight.

Something for all the family!

Links

• Shamanism: The Timeless Religion by Manvir Singh (2025)
• Prof or Hobo website
• New Yorker: The President Who Became a Prophet
• Our first interview with Manvir
• Buckner, William. 2022. "A Deceptive Curing Practice in Hunter–Gatherer Societies" Humans 2, no. 3: 95-103. https://doi.org/10.3390/humans2030007

There’s been a disturbance in the Gurusphere. Two of its central objects of worship are feuding. The guru’s guru, Elon Musk, and the MAGA God-King, Donald Trump, have finally turned on each other, trading blows on social media. In this mini supplementary episode, Matt and Chris survey the shockwaves rippling through the Gurusphere as these titanic egos collide.

It’s more slapfight than substance, but that hasn’t stopped gurus and sycophants from picking sides or admiring the sheer brass balls on display. Look out for Lex Fridman’s outside-the-box solution, Eric Weinstein’s cryptic mutterings, and some hilarious takes from the comedic genius Francis Foster. Strap in. It’s petty, it’s absurd, and it’s all happening.

Trump vs. Elon: The Gurusphere Reacts

00:00 Elon and Trump

00:26 Introduction: Elon and Trump are feuding

07:10 A little bit of context

13:11 The Gurusphere reacts

14:32 O'Fallon & Lindsay saw this coming

16:01 Eric's Trademark - Both Sidesing Obscurantism

20:38 The Big Dog's Take

24:01 Lex suggests we need a podcast!

27:10 Maculinity Hot Takes

29:50 Sensemakers Take Flight

31:17 Taleb's reasonable take!

32:14 Konstantin Climbs the Ladder of Chaos

36:37 The strategic Gaadfather & Scott Adams

37:28 Tech Bros praying for peace

39:25 The Red Scare MAGA Loyalist

40:36 Conspiratorial Narcissists and their Public Feuds

45:48 Sycophantic praise heals everything

47:07 Outro

The full episode is available for Patreon subscribers (49 mins).

Join us at: https://www.patreon.com/DecodingTheGurus

Prepare for a hearty mix of culinary tips, avoidance of hypothetical scenarios, and the usual guru grievances. Will Jordan Peterson ever admit he's a Christian? Is it ever truly possible to understand Sam Harris AND still disagree with him? And where does Joe Rogan's primal hate for owls come in? Tune in for at least some of the answers to these pressing questions in this bubbling broth of an episode.

Supplementary Material 30

00:00 Introduction and Culinary Corner

12:29 The Buddhism Book cometh

14:09 Joe Rogan on Astrology

25:22 Rogan's Christian Conversion?

32:18 Rogan on Owls...

43:09 Jordan Peterson vs 20 Atheists

48:55 Is JBP a Christian?

54:34 It depends what you mean by believe...

01:00:22 Jordan Peterson vs. hypotheticals

01:13:54 Hancock Orbiters continue to be terrible

01:19:58 Sam Harris' Business Manager is kinda bad

01:26:22 Sam is being misinterpreted again

01:35:11 The Fundamentalist Impulse

01:38:09 Post-Debate Weinstein Activity

01:40:32 Sam Harris is still mad with Ezra Klein

01:48:39 Outro

The full episode is available for Patreon subscribers (1hr 49 mins).

Join us at: https://www.patreon.com/DecodingTheGurus

Sources

- A good Irish Stew recipe

- The Buddhism Book!

- Joe Rogan Experience #2323 - Guy Fieri

- Jubilee: Jordan Peterson vs 20 Atheists | Surrounded

- Dan Richards' charming tweet to Flint

- Professor Dave: Dan Richards is a Pointless Troll

- "More From Sam": Religion, Deportations, Douglas Murray vs. Rogan, & Bill Maher's Dinner with Trump

- “More From Sam”: Trump & Israel, Corruption, Free Speech Violations, the Democrats, & Ezra Klein

- Sam Harris' Substack: What Whataboutery?

- Sam and Ezra's email exchange

- Vox: Charles Murray is once again peddling junk science about race and IQ. Podcaster and author Sam Harris is the latest to fall for it.