Assess THAT with Tom & Nat! (Assessment, Feedback, Grading, and Learning) Podcast By Tom Schimmer cover art

Assess THAT with Tom & Nat! (Assessment, Feedback, Grading, and Learning)

Assess THAT with Tom & Nat! (Assessment, Feedback, Grading, and Learning)

By: Tom Schimmer
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Assess THAT with Tom & Nat is a bi-weekly podcast where co-hosts Tom Schimmer and Natalie Vardabasso unpack what it really means to deepen assessment literacy in schools. Known for their dynamic, insightful, and sometimes provocative conversations, Tom and Nat create a space where educators can rethink grading, feedback, and accountability in ways that put student learning first. Each episode blends practical strategies with big-picture thinking, helping teachers and leaders translate research into action without losing sight of the human side of education.

Listeners can expect honest discussions, fresh perspectives, and plenty of take-home ideas. From reimagining final exams to exploring the role of assessment in equity and Universal Design for Learning, Assess THAT is for any educator ready to challenge the status quo and embrace assessment as a tool for growth—not just measurement.

About the Hosts
Tom Schimmer and Natalie Vardabasso are internationally recognized speakers, authors, and consultants who have spent their careers helping schools modernize assessment and grading practices. Together, they are the co-founders of the Canadian Assessment Centre (CAC), a national professional learning hub created by Canadians, for Canadians to bring clarity, credibility, and care to assessment in classrooms across the country.

  • Tom Schimmer is the author and co-author of multiple best-selling books, including Grading from the Inside Out and Standards-Based Learning in Action. With 35 years of experience as a teacher, leader, and consultant, Tom is known for his ability to translate big ideas into practical tools educators can use right away.

  • Natalie Vardabasso is a leading voice in assessment and equity, recognized for her innovative approaches to standards-based learning, feedback, and student agency. As a speaker, writer, and coach, she has helped thousands of educators create assessment systems that are not only accurate but also deeply humanizing.

Together, Tom and Natalie bring complementary perspectives, humour, and a deep commitment to making assessment meaningful. Their partnership in Assess THAT and at the Canadian Assessment Centre reflects a shared belief that when educators improve how they assess, they unlock the full potential of every learner.

Tom and Natalie are also the authors of Rehumanizing Assessment: Gathering Evidence of Learning Through Storytelling, a book that challenges traditional grading systems and shows how assessment can honour student voice and identity.

Why Listen?
Whether you’re a classroom teacher, school leader, or policy maker, Assess THAT with Tom & Nat will challenge your assumptions, equip you with actionable strategies, and inspire you to see assessment as the most powerful driver of student success.

Copyright 2020 All rights reserved.
Episodes
  • 32 - Why Feedback Fails (And What Actually Makes It Work)

    32 - Why Feedback Fails (And What Actually Makes It Work)
    Mar 30 2026

    In this episode, Tom and Nat take a hard look at one of the most celebrated and misunderstood elements of teaching: feedback. While research consistently shows that feedback can significantly improve student achievement, the reality in many classrooms is very different. Too often, feedback is given but not used, leaving teachers frustrated and students unchanged. Together, they unpack five key reasons feedback fails, including the impact of grades, cognitive overload, poor timing, over-directiveness, and the emotional side of how feedback lands with students.

    More importantly, this episode shifts the conversation from effort to design. Tom and Nat explore what actually makes feedback effective (not in theory, but in practice), offering clear, actionable principles that help ensure feedback leads to thinking, revision, and growth. If you’ve ever wondered why your feedback isn’t getting the results you hoped for, this episode will challenge your assumptions and give you a more intentional, impactful way forward.

    Feedback Flow Mini-Course

    Assess THAT on YouTube!

    🍁 CANADIAN ASSESSMENT CENTRE

    Join our mailing list for assessment strategies, new podcast episodes, upcoming events, and all things Canadian Assessment.

    JOIN HERE

    • CAC on Instagram
    • CAC on Facebook
    • CAC on X
    • EMAIL: info@canadianassessment.ca

    PROFESSIONAL LEARNING EVENTS

    -Apr. 1-2, 2026 (Tom) Grading from the Inside Out (Franklin, TN)

    -Apr. 9-10, 2026 Canadian Assessment Spring Conference (Vancouver, BC)

    NEW BOOK FROM TOM & NAT

    • Rehumanizing Assessment

    CONNECT WITH TOM & NATALIE

    • Podcast on X
    • Tom on X
    • Natalie on X
    • Podcast on IG
    • Tom on IG
    • Natalie on IG
    Show more Show less
    34 mins
  • 31 - Averaging Is Statistically Convenient and Educationally Misleading

    31 - Averaging Is Statistically Convenient and Educationally Misleading
    Mar 16 2026

    Averaging feels neutral, objective, and mathematically sound, but in the context of student learning, it can quietly distort the story a grade is meant to tell. In this episode, Tom and Natalie take a deep dive into the statistics that dominate most gradebooks (mean, median, and mode) and unpack why tools designed to summarize stable data can mislead us when applied to something as dynamic as human learning. Along the way, they explore the hidden problems of equal weighting, outliers, small sample sizes, and the false precision created by decimals that suggest more accuracy than the evidence can truly support.

    Through practical examples and thought-provoking scenarios, Tom and Natalie show how averaging can punish growth, hide mastery, and cement early struggles into final judgments. But this episode isn’t anti-math; it’s about measurement clarity. They explore the limited situations where averaging can be helpful and offer practical alternatives for blending statistical summaries with professional judgment so that grades communicate what they’re supposed to: a meaningful and defensible interpretation of student learning.

    Assess THAT on YouTube!

    🍁 CANADIAN ASSESSMENT CENTRE

    Join our mailing list for assessment strategies, new podcast episodes, upcoming events, and all things Canadian Assessment. JOIN HERE

    • CAC on Instagram
    • CAC on Facebook
    • CAC on X
    • EMAIL: info@canadianassessment.ca

    PROFESSIONAL LEARNING EVENTS

    -Apr. 1-2, 2026 (Tom) Grading from the Inside Out (Franklin, TN)

    -Apr. 9-10, 2026 Canadian Assessment Spring Conference (Vancouver, BC)

    NEW BOOK FROM TOM & NAT

    • Rehumanizing Assessment

    CONNECT WITH TOM & NATALIE

    • Podcast on X
    • Tom on X
    • Natalie on X
    • Podcast on IG
    • Tom on IG
    • Natalie on IG
    Show more Show less
    35 mins
  • 30 - Assessment Literacy Is the Real "Teacher Shortage"

    30 - Assessment Literacy Is the Real "Teacher Shortage"
    Mar 5 2026

    Across education, we hear constant concern about teacher shortages. On the surface, it seems like recruitment pipelines, retention rates, burnout, and workload are the issues. But beneath those very real challenges lies a quieter, more systemic issue: many educators have never received deep, sustained support for developing assessment literacy. When teachers lack clarity around evidence, criteria, professional judgment, and grading accuracy, everything becomes heavier. Grading expands, decision fatigue sets in, parent conversations feel tense, and confidence erodes.

    In this episode, Tom & Natalie argue that strengthening assessment literacy isn’t just about improving grading practices, it’s about stabilizing the profession itself. When teachers understand what counts as evidence, how to separate behaviour from achievement, and how to make defensible judgments about learning, workload becomes more manageable, and confidence grows. Assessment literacy reduces friction, restores professional agency, and creates coherence across classrooms and schools. If we want teachers to stay (and thrive) this is foundational work we can’t afford to overlook.

    Assess THAT on YouTube!

    🍁 CANADIAN ASSESSMENT CENTRE

    Join our mailing list for assessment strategies, new podcast episodes, upcoming events, and all things Canadian Assessment. JOIN HERE

    • CAC on Instagram
    • CAC on Facebook
    • CAC on X
    • EMAIL: info@canadianassessment.ca

    PROFESSIONAL LEARNING EVENTS

    -Mar. 18-21, 2026 (Tom) EARCOS Teacher Conference (Bangkok, TH)

    -Apr. 1-2, 2026 (Tom) Grading from the Inside Out (Franklin, TN)

    -Apr. 9-10, 2026 Canadian Assessment Spring Conference (Vancouver, BC)

    NEW BOOK FROM TOM & NAT

    • Rehumanizing Assessment

    CONNECT WITH TOM & NATALIE

    • Podcast on X
    • Tom on X
    • Natalie on X
    • Podcast on IG
    • Tom on IG
    • Natalie on IG
    Show more Show less
    50 mins
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