Mary and Lou and Rhoda and Ted

And All the Brilliant Minds Who Made the Mary Tyler Moore Show a Classic

By: Jennifer Armstrong

Narrated by: Amy Landon

Length: 11 hrs and 21 mins

Publisher's Summary

Mary Tyler Moore made her name as Dick Van Dyke's wife on the eponymous show; she was a cute, unassuming housewife that audiences loved. But when screenwriters James Brooks and Allan Burnes dreamed up an edgy show about a divorced woman with a career, network executives replied: "Americans won't watch television about New York City, divorcées, men with mustaches, or Jews." But Moore and her team were committed, and when the show finally aired, in spite of tepid reviews, fans loved it.

Jennifer Keishin Armstrong introduces listeners to the show's creators; its principled producer, Grant Tinker; and the writers and actors who attracted millions of viewers. As the first situation comedy to employ numerous women as writers and producers, The Mary Tyler Moore Show became a guiding light for women in the 1970s. The show also became the centerpiece of one of greatest evenings of comedy in television history, and Jennifer Keishin Armstrong describes how the television industry evolved during these golden years.

©2013 Jennifer Keishin Armstrong (P)2013 Tantor

The Narrator Came from the Ted Baxter School ...

The book is interesting, especially for those of us who were ther. It is unfortunate that the reader detracts so much from the story. Her simpleton lilting voice (which unfortunately lilts in the wrong places) is bad enough, but her awkward attempt to voice characters is painful. If you are interested in this book, spare yourself and buy the written or e-book.

An Interesting Story That Never Quite Gets Told

To hear this book tell it, the Mary Tyler Moore show just seemed to happen, and this is the story of people who were kinda sorta around when it did.

The author spends an enormous amount of time on stories that never pay off, and she seems to have no interest in how episodes were actually made. She follows one writer from her early days as a club entertainer to her eventual staff job on the show, and then to her travels in Europe, but we never get any insight on what that same writer's life was like on the MTMS staff. What did she do every day? How did she and the staff break stories, what kind of leeway did she have to alter characters? Did she have a unique take on the characters that made her noteworthy a writer?

Early in the book we're told that the show's creators were hired to write a show for Mary Tyler Moore, and then, suddenly, they have a script. We never get any insight into how that script was created, or where the ideas came from. And when those writers decide to change the script to conform to network notes, well, then all of a sudden they have a changed script. We're never privy to the actual making of those changes.

This lack of detail is especially troubling when it comes to James Brooks. Brooks appears on virtually every page of the narrative, but we don't get any insight into his creative process. We get a sentence or two telling us that Brooks dominated the writers room, but no insight into how that room worked. (Was there even a writers room on this show? I don't know, because it's not in the book.) Brooks goes from an ambitious writer to a TV genius, but we're told it happens, and are never shown how it happened. How did writers pitch show ideas? How did Brooks respond to those pitches, how did he change them, what was his spin? Brooks is one of a handful of people who changed TV forever, and this book gives us no sense of what his day--to-day work was on the show. Why, by the book's end, do I know more about the writing habits of a (sort of creepy) Mary Tyler Moore super fan than I do about the guy who this book is largely about? (And how in the world does Brooks' later co-creation of The Simpsons rate one half of one sentence about Julie Kavner?)

As for the book's narration, it is, frankly, hilarious, though not intentionally. The narrator mispronounces so many famous names, it's like she's setting us up for a drinking game. Howard CAsell? Really? Gavin McCloud went on to play Captain Stubbing, as in something you do to your toe? Desi Arnaz's last name looks like it rhymes with "has", but it really rhymes with "fez" — someone should have told the narrator. And these are just off the top of my head. There are at least 5 or 6 more. Every time you hear one, do a shot. It'll make the book more enjoyable.

Good story but pathetic narration

Really interesting background information - for fans of the show as well as TV production in general. However, this narrator needs to do her homework - I would be interested to know how she got this job, as she clearly had no knowledge of the subject matter. First, she mispronounces common words such as "demurred" (at least 3 times) - but the problems really arose when she mispronounced the last name of Suzanne Pleshette as well as Captain Stubing (Gavin McLeod on The Love Boat). I find it incredibly disrespectful of the entire process - if the narrator can't be bothered to learn about the subject matter, where are the editors? Just sad.

Unfortunate Reader, Story on for Die-Hard MTM Fans

One of the worst readings ever. The narrator's intonation is meant for an audience of 6 year olds. She sounds like someone who never actually listens to audiobooks.

I slugged through it anyway. The story behind the show is interesting, but be warned this book is as much about the writers and producers as it is the actors. I happen to like that, but I could understand if some folks felt gyped that it meandered so much.

HORRIBLE narrator - don't even think buying it.

What disappointed you about Mary and Lou and Rhoda and Ted?

Bought it, and listened 10 minutes - and that narrator is the worst I have ever heard. Makes me really angry that Audible still insist on selling this. This audible book is going right back, and in fact I am questioning the worth of this membership..

How did the narrator detract from the book?

She was being dramatic at EVERY word... e-v-e-r-y W=o-r-d.. it detracted from the book as all you hear IS HER VOCAL EXERCISES...

You didn’t love this book... but did it have any redeeming qualities?

NONE

Any additional comments?

how dare Audible insist on selling such sub-quality product !!

Fascinating reading!

Would you listen to Mary and Lou and Rhoda and Ted again? Why?

Yes, I would definitely listen to some parts again. To hear the background of one of television's most successful series is a real treat to anyone who grew up watching this landmark show. The behind the scenes stories are priceless.

Who would you have cast as narrator instead of Amy Landon?

I think I would prefer someone who bothered to read the book ahead of time. Judging from her line readings she frequently didn't seem to know the intent of the sentence. The only time I've ever heard results like that is when someone is doing a cold reading. Also distracting was her mispronunciation of certain names (such as Gavin MacLeod's Love Boat character - Captain Stubing which she pronounced as "STUBBING" as opposed to the familiar "STEWBING") The performance doesn't ruin the experience but it certainly doesn't enhance it.

pretty good

I don't mind the narration, as some do. It fits the overall l tone of a feminist book, I think. But it does go off on too many tangents, without enough attention to the MTM Show itself. Still, good for fans, until a better book comes along.

Worst narrator ever

I was so excited to hear this, but I ended up checking it out of the library instead. This experience convinced me to listen to the sample narration before using a credit. She was that bad.

Difference of opinion

Would you recommend this audiobook to a friend? If so, why?

Yes (especially if they are 40 yrs or older)

Any additional comments?

I actually thoroughly enjoyed this "biography" of a beloved show from my youth. I not only appreciated all that transpired to bring the "Mary Tyler Moore Show" to the small screen, but enjoyed the narration equally. Clearly many other listeners were disappointed by the reader's performance -- an opinion that I certainly respect (especially since I, too, have been put off by poor narration in the past) -- but I just wanted to register that the opinion was not unanimous.

Very Interesting Overall

This book contains a lot of interesting information and I would recommend it. I did, however, have a few issues. I did not care for the narrator – – there was just something about her voice that almost had a lecture-y quality to it. She also pronounced a handful of names incorrectly, which was irritating. It poignantly reminds the listener that she is simply reading the words without being familiar with what she is actually talking about. One example was her pronunciation of Captain Stubing from the Love Boat (Stubbing, is how she said it).

Regarding the content of the book, there were a few things that were factually incorrect, and simply didn’t make sense. One gets the sense that the author was trying to make some point about how women put their dreams on hold in order to play the real-life part of housewife in the 1950s-1960s. While that may have been true, in many cases, the author made that point about Cloris Leachman, stating that she had been a housewife, putting her dreams aside for 17 years until the Mary Tyler Moore show. Having seen Leachman in various things, I did a little research and found that she had some 130 parts between her marriage in 1953 and the Mary Tyler Moore show in 1970. This is a non-fiction book and I am reading in order to get information – – I shouldn’t have to do my own research. Armstrong also claimed that Ed Asner was 50 years old when the Mary Tyler Moore show started. He was 40. She claimed that Ted Knight’s parents were part of the Polish immigration wave after World War II. This makes no sense, considering the fact that Ted Knight was born in America about 20 years before World War II started. He fought in the war as well. These are just the things that I noticed. There may be more which is irritating considering the fact that I listened to the book for information and would like it to be accurate. Along these lines, there were also times where I felt like the author was trying to make the facts— through her own two cents— fit neatly into a certain feminist narrative. Again I have absolutely no problem with facts being facts, but there were times I felt that she had a bit of an agenda. Overall, the book was good, and extremely interesting, and I learned a lot. Despite the few bumps in the road, I would recommend the book to fans of the Mary Tyler Moore Show.