Dr. Chantelle Thomas chats with Ronica Mukerjee, DNP, MsA, FNP-BC, PMHNP-BC, LAc, a family and psychiatric nurse practitioner and acupuncturist, discusses her multifaceted work, including holistic psychiatry, gender-affirming care, and psychedelic-assisted treatment. She highlights her work with refugees, particularly Haitians, and her efforts to establish a free trans care program. Ronica shares her experiences in Tijuana during COVID-19, providing medical care in a chaotic environment. She emphasizes the need for inclusive, culturally sensitive approaches to mental health and psychedelic therapy, particularly for marginalized communities. Ronica is also developing educational resources to make psychedelic work accessible to a broader audience.

(0:00:34) Introduction

(0:03:14) Work in Mexico and Refugee Health

(0:09:45) Challenges and Experiences in Tijuana

(0:25:16) Psychedelic-Assisted Treatment and Its Impact

(0:47:41) Challenges in Psychedelic Research and Access

(0:49:39) The Role of Psychedelics in Mental Health

(0:50:05) The Future of Psychedelic Therapy and Research

Dr. Chantelle Thomas, Executive Clinical Director Windrose Recovery: https://windroserecovery.com/

Integrata: www.integratahealing.com

Ronica Mukerjee, DNP, MsA, FNP-BC, PMHNP-BC, LAc, Assistant Professor of Nursing at CUMC: https://www.nursing.columbia.edu/profile/ronica-mukerjee-dnp

Lykos: https://lykospbc.com

Dr. Chantelle Thomas and Dr. Ingmar Gorman discuss the safety and ethical considerations of MDMA-assisted psychotherapy for PTSD, including standardization, non-directive approach, and adherence to therapy protocol. They also explore complex power dynamics in therapeutic relationships, ethical nuances of supporting participants in psychedelic studies, and the importance of representing a diverse population in psychedelic trials.

(00:00:00) Introduction

(00:10:30) Therapist-participant relationships in psychedelic-assisted therapy trial.

(00:14:58) Challenges in supporting participants in psychedelic studies after the end of the trial.

(00:23:11) Standardizing therapy for MDMA-assisted therapy trial.

(00:32:11) The importance of non-directional support.

(00:36:37) Operationalizing therapy techniques to ensure consistency and address power imbalances.

(00:43:06) Psychedelic therapy adherence and rating systems.

(00:50:08) Therapist flexibility in the trial.

(00:59:41) Inclusion of diverse participants.

Dr. Chantelle Thomas, Executive Clinical Director Windrose Recovery: https://windroserecovery.com/

Integrata: www.integratahealing.com

Dr. Ingmar Gorman: https://www.ingmargorman.com/about

Lykos: https://lykospbc.com

Dr. Chantelle Thomas talks to Dr. Ingmar Gorman about concerns and methodological critiques of MDMA-assisted therapy, including historical boundary violations and inappropriate treatment of participants. They also address adverse event management, inner healing intelligence, and the importance of adapting language and approach to resonate with each individual participant. Additionally, they discuss the ethical complexities of conducting clinical trials, including balancing participant privacy and safety with the need to share information for public advocacy and education. Finally, they delve into the intricacies of trauma therapy, including personal experiences, clinical approaches, and limitations, and emphasize the need for a paradigm shift in clinical practice, prioritizing the client's agency and internal resources for healing.

(0:00:00) Introduction

(0:10:14) FDA's decision on MDMA therapy for PTSD, with focus on ICER and FDA advisory panel reports.

(0:15:21) The benefits and challenges of a clinical trial for treating PTSD.

(0:21:03) Conducting clinical trials with nuanced considerations for ethics, regulations, and participant experiences.

(0:31:52) Adverse events in the trial, with concerns about data accuracy and researcher bias.

(0:44:02) Suicidal ideation and its impact on mental health treatment.

(0:52:23) Clinical trial design and unblinding issues in PTSD treatment study.

(0:59:26) MDMA therapy for trauma, participants' experiences and criticisms.

(1:05:31) Trauma therapy effectiveness and the importance of considering other measures beyond PTSD symptoms.

(1:10:36) Inner healing intelligence in MDMA-assisted therapy.

(1:29:51) MDMA-assisted therapy for PTSD, including resourcing and adherence.

Dr. Chantelle Thomas, Executive Clinical Director Windrose Recovery: https://windroserecovery.com/

Integrata: www.integratahealing.com

Dr. Ingmar Gorman: https://www.ingmargorman.com/about

Lykos: https://lykospbc.com