Medical trainees spend years mastering what to do when biology fails — countless protocols, procedures, and split-second decisions. By the end, they’re primed to fix what’s broken. But what if the mandate of medicine is simpler — and more human?

Our guest on this episode is Dr. Jessica Zitter — a physician, author, and filmmaker who has spent her career at the fault line between intensive care and palliative care. Dr. Zitter was initially drawn to the technical choreography in the ICU: numbers to chase, procedures to perform. Yet, along the way, she began to notice the danger we rarely name — that in our devotion to protocol, we might drift away from the person in front of us.

Over the course of our conversation, Dr. Zitter shares personal experiences that have shaped her approach to medicine. We talk about moral injury and how it compounds: when systems push us to act against our values, care gets worse, and the hurt deepens. We talk about how bias slips in when power meets prejudice at the bedside and why chaplains — so often sidelined — can be essential guides back to the human being we’re treating. Her prescription is simple: treat patients as you’d want your own loved ones to be treated. Ask for the story. Reconstruct the person we’ve taken apart into smaller pieces.

Dr. Zitter is the author of her memoir Extreme Measures, appears in the Academy Award-nominated short film Extremis, and is the director of several documentaries, including 2025’s The Chaplain & the Doctor.

In this episode, you’ll hear about:

2:45 - Dr. Zitter’s path to a career in intensive care medicine

4:52 - A day in the life of an intensivist

17:42 - Dr. Zitter’s unexpected pivot to prioritizing palliative care in her work

26:41 - The inspiration for Dr. Zitter’s film The Chaplain and the Doctor

38:36 - How chaplaincy attends to the soul of the patient and what doctors can learn from this perspective

42:51 - Navigating internalized bias as a doctor

49:42 - Dr. Zitter’s advice for her younger self

Visit our website www.TheDoctorsArt.com where you can find transcripts of all episodes.

If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, rate, and review our show, available for free on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you know of a doctor, patient, or anyone working in health care who would love to explore meaning in medicine with us on the show, feel free to leave a suggestion in the comments or send an email to info@thedoctorsart.com.

Copyright The Doctor’s Art Podcast 2025

Editorial Note:

This episode was recorded in December 2024, after the nomination of Robert F Kennedy Jr as Secretary of Health and Human Services had been announced but prior to his confirmation. Some comments by the podcast hosts and our guest will reflect this timing.

Elephants rarely get cancer, ants quarantine when sick, and altruistic pigs have a higher pain tolerance. In this episode, we discuss insights from the animal world that shed light on human health and wellness, as well as the power of data driven narratives in effective public health education.

Our guest is Dr. David Agus, founding CEO of the Ellison Medical Institute and professor of medicine and engineering at the University of Southern California. As a CBS news contributor and author of three New York Times best selling books on health, Dr. Agus emphasizes the need for experts who are willing to explain rather than tell.

Having experienced the politicization of public health during the pandemic, he highlights the importance of data transparency and the urgency for more physician leaders. With technological advances making data collection and analysis ever more accessible, Dr. Agus shares a vision for the future of medicine, where patients bring their own health data to the clinic and physicians act as educators guided by the values of their patients.

In this episode, you’ll hear about:

2:30 - Dr. Agus’s journey to medicine and how he found his way to focusing on preventative health and public education

6:50 - Navigating the politicized nature of public health as a public health educator

14:17 - Dr. Agus’s viewpoint on the controversial nominations of RFK Jr. and Dr. Oz

19:51 - How the education of doctor needs to change to adapt to our newly data driven world

24:20 - The current state of nutrition science and how people can make the best choices with the current data available on the topic

32:12 - The potential benefits of making big data in electronic medical records available to physicians

32:48 - The inspiration behind Dr. Agus’s new book, The Book of Animal Secrets, and what the animal kingdom can teach us as humans about living a more fulfilling and healthy life

52:11 - A vision for empowering patients with their personal medical data in the age of AI

54:31 - Dr. Agus’s advice to clinicians on supporting patients with their preventative health

Visit our website www.TheDoctorsArt.com where you can find transcripts of all episodes.

If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, rate, and review our show, available for free on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you know of a doctor, patient, or anyone working in health care who would love to explore meaning in medicine with us on the show, feel free to leave a suggestion in the comments or send an email to info@thedoctorsart.com.

Copyright The Doctor’s Art Podcast 2025

Imagine practicing medicine not within the sterile confines of a hospital, but in the unpredictable world of city streets and shelters, where every patient encounter challenges conventional notions of care, empathy, and human dignity. We explore this reality through the extraordinary journey of Jim O'Connell, MD, whose groundbreaking work with Boston's homeless population has profoundly reshaped health care for society's most marginalized individuals.

Dr. O'Connell is the founding president of the Boston Healthcare for the Homeless Program and an assistant professor of medicine at Harvard Medical School. In this episode, Dr. O’Connell shares stories from his extensive frontline experience, detailing the unique challenges of treating patients facing complex medical and psychiatric conditions exacerbated by unstable living conditions. From addressing devastating public health crises such as AIDS and tuberculosis to establishing consistent mental health care, he provides profound insights into what makes healthcare effective for homeless populations. He also reflects on a formative early experience — being asked by nurses to wash patients feet — that deeply influenced his understanding of empathy and the essence of medical service. Through these reflections, we gain a powerful appreciation for the depth of patience, relational care, and respect required in caring for vulnerable communities.

In this episode, you’ll hear about:

2:00 - Dr. O’Connell’s unexpected path to medicine

11:34 - The distinction between a “country doctor” and a doctor who works in an academic setting

13:42 - How Dr. O’Connell began working with homeless populations

20:30 - The difficulties doctors faced in the early years of the HIV/AIDS epidemic

29:14 - Navigating the compounding challenges of access and continuity among the homeless population

37:12 - What has kept Dr. O’Connell dedicated to treating this population for 30+ years

51:24 - Dr. O’Connell’s recommendations to clinicians on how to compassionately serve the homeless

Visit our website www.TheDoctorsArt.com where you can find transcripts of all episodes.

If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, rate, and review our show, available for free on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you know of a doctor, patient, or anyone working in health care who would love to explore meaning in medicine with us on the show, feel free to leave a suggestion in the comments or send an email to info@thedoctorsart.com.

Copyright The Doctor’s Art Podcast 2025