Episodios

  • 3.7 — “Science Says” - Stress, Welfare, and Punishment: Dogma vs. Reality with Dr. Melanie Uhde

    3.7 — “Science Says” - Stress, Welfare, and Punishment: Dogma vs. Reality with Dr. Melanie Uhde
    Jan 1 2026

    “Science” is often invoked in dog training discussions to signal intelligence, moral superiority, and to shame those who advocate for balanced approaches. In Episode 3.7, hosts Jenny Nordin and Ashlyn Kauh sit down with neurobiologist and dog trainer Dr. Melanie Uhde to examine what science actually says about stress, punishment, welfare, and learning—and what that means for modern dog training.

    Together, they unpack the studies most commonly cited to condemn punishment, explaining why many fail to reflect real-world training and why metrics like cortisol or body language alone don’t capture long-term outcomes such as confidence, resilience, and success in real homes. They differentiate acute vs. chronic stress and explore stress inoculation, highlighting research that shows how appropriate stress can build coping skills and improve behavioral and neurological outcomes.

    The conversation also tackles aversive control, discussing why—when applied correctly—it can be more reliable, persistent, and generalizable than reward-only approaches. Finally, they connect the science to everyday life with dogs, addressing puppies, fosters, fearful dogs, and why aversive control shouldn’t be treated as a last resort. This is a nuanced, evidence-based discussion focused on moving past ideology and toward training that genuinely improves dogs’ lives in the real world.


    Mentions:

    Melanie Uhde Biograph

    Michael Ellis

    Cooper study

    Ivan's podcast discussion on Cooper study

    Shocking rats causes aggression

    Stress inoculation in mice

    Dopamine and aversive control


    Scientific terms defined:

    • Confirmation Bias
    • Methods
    • Causation
    • Correlation
    • Control
    • Cortisol
    • Stress inoculation
    • Hippocampus
    • Learned helplessness
    • Early Neurological Stimulation (ENS)

    Social:

    Dr. Melanie Uhde

    • Facebook: @Dr.Melanie.Uhde
    • Instagram: @caninedecoded

    So You Want to Run a Dog Rescue

    • Facebook: @DGS.Podcast
    • Instagram: @DGS.Podcast
    • Email: soyouwanttorunadogrescue@gmail.com


    00:00 3.7: Science Says with Dr. Melanie Uhde

    06:11 Why this conversation matters right now

    15:03 Methodological issues with frequently cited studies

    26:51 Welfare conclusions

    37:08 The case for stress

    44:26 Implications for epidemic of anxious dogs

    49:56 The role of ENS

    53:13 The case for punishment

    58:14 How to prevent fallout from punishment

    01:04:30 Why punishment should not be a 'last resort'

    01:11:20 Advice for adopters

    01:15:33 Simply daily habits for the average dog owner to build dog's resilience

    01:20:08 Final last questions
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    1 h y 32 m
  • 3.6: Starting with Science — A Primer on Operant Conditioning (and Where We Stand on Training, Officially)

    3.6: Starting with Science — A Primer on Operant Conditioning (and Where We Stand on Training, Officially)
    Dec 28 2025
    Recorded six weeks ago—if that gives any indication of how busy things have been — Episode 3.6 is short, sweet, and sets the table for the Season 3 finale with Dr. Melanie Uhde.Before taking listeners all the way to Science Town, hosts Jenny Nordin and Ashlyn Kauh start with the basics: operant conditioning, the four quadrants, and what “punishment” actually means—hint: the dog decides, and it’s not a squirt bottle (at least not for Jenny’s GSD, Mando).Beyond terminology, this episode marks the first time balanced training is the main topic of discussion. Against the backdrop of an ideological war between training camps (and after experiencing some truly unhinged reactions to their willingness to stop behaviors that were quite literally going to get dogs killed), Ashlyn and Jenny discuss why balanced training is not only necessary, but often life-saving. They share real-world examples drawn from a statistically significant sample size (yes, they’re being scientific now) and explore whether lived experience can meaningfully influence the broader conversation. Or not—because, Jenny wonders, is it not just all the dogs on drugs?The episode also includes highlights from the Michael Ellis / Melanie Uhde Aversive Control seminar, including a gummy-adjacent encounter with a local trainer/breeder that very nearly didn’t make the cut.And for listeners less invested in the science and training discussion, skip ahead to Questions: resident nutrition savant Ashlyn shares some truly useful recommendations—especially for large breeds—you won’t want to miss.Stay tuned for Behind the Scenes where the banter is real, and listeners will understand why Shadowfax will never be invited to a podcast recording again.POD MENTIONS:Melanie UhdeMichael Ellis SchoolFixers Collective ReelAVSAB Veterinary Position StatementNutriscanOptagestMushroom Matrix Skin & CoatMyosConnectinCosequinPARTNER MENTIONS:Fixers CollectiveSaving Great AnimalsForever Home Dog RescueWashington Health OutreachRegional Animal Services King CountyPAWSADOPTABLE DOG MENTIONS:Tera TailsMosesCutie PieMangoThovenLunaRicoAsk us anything via Email: soyouwanttorunadogrescue@gmail.comFollow us on social media at @dgs.podcast00:00 3.6 Starting with Science01:12 Intro and exciting announcements03:39 3.5 Recap Dogs Biting Kids Fixers Collective10:21 Mango return13:16 Dogs on drugs but what are the people on?16:41 Melanie Uhde Primer20:43 Why we haven't REALLY talked about this before24:56 Operant Conditioning Primer: R+-P+-28:58 Punishment determined by behavior (dog determines what is aversive)30:58 Why punishment matters (stopping unwanted behaviors)34:17 Rolex breeder AWKWARD40:35 Running out of gas42:16 Good time at the seminar44:43 Why this is so important47:24 Real world experience: Luna53:41 A couple questions for Ashlyn on nutriscan (we got Joe's back) and Myos56:49 Myos question01:00:00 Final thoughts on "science"01:01:49 Behind the Scenes01:05:29 to dish or not to dish01:06:55 dog shot in cemetery01:07:28 Bloopers
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    1 h y 10 m
  • 3.5: Dogs Biting Kids + 9-5 Crazy F*cking Shit List = Big Feelings

    3.5: Dogs Biting Kids + 9-5 Crazy F*cking Shit List = Big Feelings
    Nov 21 2025
    Season 3 Episode 5: Feral, F-bomb heavy, and full of chaos. Hosts Jenny Nordin and Ashlyn Kauh start off “normally” enough—updates on the Dog Detective Case Files, Fixers Collective, and some behind-the-scenes strategery involving a spreadsheet so convoluted Jenny had to learn something called Javascript just to make it work. But then… Jenny goes off the rails. Spreadsheet-induced madness? Or just every day insanity of running the largest dog rescue in the PNW? You decide.Main topic: Dogs biting kids. Not great. Often complicated, but sometimes just screamingly obvious bad (human and/or canine) parenting. Lately, every day (9-5 and then some) has been full of Crazy Shit so this episode throws the usual segments into a blender and hits puree. (Cue the F-Bombs.) From “Dangerous Dog" designations who "just need a CGC" to maniacal keyboard warriors and delulu adopters sending novels to an overflowing inbox, the drama is real and the feelings are big.Grab your popcorn if you're here for the soapbox. Otherwise, skip to the Questions for super useful info on Nutriscan testing for food allergies.POD MENTIONS:Aversive Control SeminarMichael Ellis School Melanie Uhde [Canine Decoded]Bite Level in Dogs [Veterinary Partner]NutriScan [HemoPet]Dr. Jean Dodds [HemoPet]Animal Apologists Podcast [Spotify]Kayleigh and Dogs (Animal Apologists) [Instagram]PARNTER MENTIONS:Fixers Collective [Instagram]Crossroads VetDog B GoodDouble Down Dog TrainingThe Good Dog WayAll the Best Pet CareADOPTABLE DOG MENTIONS: LunaRexPennyLeoFreyaRicoAsk us anything via Email to soyouwanttorunadogrescue@gmail.comFollow us on social media at @dgs.podcastDon't forget to Like, Share, Comment and Subscribe!Chapters00:00 3.5 Dogs Biting Kids01:45 3.4 Updates: Luna, Sprinkles, Heist09:01 What we've been up to (it's a lot)12:34 Aversive Control Seminar at Michael Ellis School14:28 Fixers Collective 2.017:24 Adoption Updates (Thank you Kris)18:21 Main Topic: Dogs Who Bite Kids19:30 Screening adult dogs for placement in homes with kids23:21 Dog in the home and having a baby24:55 But first: Bite Levels (The Bite Scale)30:56 Lessons from Mando37:48 Adding a dog to a family with kids44:50 Ash's Adopter - Training YAY49:28 Mango's Adopter - Not Great55:21 Hindsight is 20-2001:01:04 Take home message01:05:49 A 9 to 5 of Crazy Shit01:06:15 A 'dangerous' husky at Monroe PD who just needs a CGC01:10:51 Most presumptuous surrender email ever01:13:45 Freaking giant waste of time keyboard warriors01:28:56 Questions: Nutriscan by Hemopet01:32:08 Rico's Nutriscan results01:38:53 Closing thoughts01:39:32 Deleted Scenes
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    1 h y 42 m
  • 3.4: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Dog Rescue Edition)

    3.4: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly (Dog Rescue Edition)
    Nov 3 2025

    Apologies for the delay — after intaking 30 dogs in just four days, hosts Jenny Nordin and Ashlyn Kauh have had their hands (and homes) full. In Episode 3.4, they catch up on 3.3 Case Files (Luna, Rex, and Claudette) and take listeners behind the scenes of Not Your 9 to 5, where round-the-clock care at the Community Center is now part of the job.

    The main discussion covers wins, losses, and downright WTF moments — including one tearful Zoom call (awkward, and probably fueled by sleep deprivation) and a very unfortunate-looking dog. On the Shit List this week: an adopter/surrenderer in serious contention for Shittiest Shit Listee, breaking contracts and basic decency. The silver lining? An OG foster swoops in to save the day. Finally, in Questions, they tackle Smegma — a word that they wish didn’t exist.


    POD MENTIONS:

    LEADing the Pack Animal Welfare Conference [The Washington Federation of Animal Care and Control Agencies]
    Janelle Envy Tattoo [Instagram]
    The Canine Conference
    Melanie Uhde [Instagram]
    Zeffy
    Dog Gone Deck of Cards Fundraiser [Zeffy]
    Myos
    Nutriscan

    PARNTER MENTIONS:

    K9 Kennel Boss
    The Good Dog Way
    Veterinary Emergency Group (VEG)
    Crossroads Vet
    Tacoma Humane Society

    ADOPTABLE DOG MENTIONS:

    Padfoot
    Lefty
    Rico

    Ask us anything via Email to soyouwanttorunadogrescue@gmail.com

    Follow us on social media at @dgs.podcast

    Don't forget to Like, Share, Comment and Subscribe!

    Chapters

    00:00 3.4: The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly: Rescue Edition

    00:31 Excuses for podcast delays

    04:39 Updates on Dog Detective Case Files: Luna, Rex and Claudette

    11:21 A little inside 'secret'

    19:36 Really freaking awesome adoptions: Ryder round 2

    22:41 MoVal sheppies and Sprinkles meet and greet

    29:17 Walter the poodle! (When we celebrate a foster fail)

    30:48 Not Your 9 to 5: Community Center Dog Sitch

    36:39 Hodgepodge: The Good, the Bad and the Ugly

    37:30 The Good: Zeffy and Rico

    45:17 The Bad: The Day-to-Day Grind

    49:01 The Ugly (Crying on a Zoom anyone?)

    52:49 Ashlyn's Ugly Nephew Dog Heist

    58:03 Shit List

    01:07:27 Questions: Smegma (not our favorite word)

    01:07:31 Questions
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    1 h y 12 m
  • 3.3 — Dog Detective Case Files: Luna, Rex and Clyde

    3.3 — Dog Detective Case Files: Luna, Rex and Clyde
    Oct 12 2025
    Rescue dogs don’t come with a sign on their head listing all their most important information It’s often the rescuer’s job to figure it out — piecing together clues from stakeholders, vet records, and in-person evaluations to paint a picture of each dog’s past, present, and future.In Episode 3.3, hosts Jenny Nordin and Ashlyn Kauh dive into three remarkable cases: Luna, a returned cattle dog (adopted as a puppy) with “debilitating anxiety”; Rex, an owner-surrendered shepherd arriving beyond emaciated with no clear medical explanation; and Clyde (Claudette), an unexpected quasi-feral shelter intake.They also recap a whirlwind stretch of over 30 new intakes — complete with the usual chaos (hello, kennel cough — see Not Your 9 to 5) — and skip the “Shit List” this week in favor of celebrating collaboration. Partnered rescues helped save 15 more lives, and that’s worth spotlighting.This episode pulls back the curtain on detective work in rescue, highlights the power of partnership, and delivers the usual side of chaos, humor, and emotional endurance — all in a day’s work for a rescuer.POD MENTIONS:Diagnosing Kennel Cough in Dogs: A Comprehensive Guide [Kinship]Body Condition Score (BCS) Chart for Dogs [Association for Pet Obesity Prevention]The Honest KitchenCushing’s Disease in Dogs: Signs and Treatment [MedVet]Laboratory Tests Confirming Cushing's Syndrome [Veterinary Partner]PARNTER MENTIONS:Tail Lights Rescue ProjectSTART RescueK9 Kennel BossNirvana K9 TrainingCrossroads VetStanislaus Modesto Animal ServicesSaving Great AnimalsYakima Valley Pet Rescue (Valley Spay & Neuter)Furry FreightADOPTABLE DOG MENTIONS: MurrayAbigailLunaAsk us anything via Email to soyouwanttorunadogrescue@gmail.comFollow us on social media at @dgs.podcastDon't forget to Like, Share, Comment and Subscribe!Chapters00:00 3.3 — Dog Detective Case Files: Luna, Rex and Clyde03:36 Huge week for intakes07:53 A present for Ashlyn11:31 Our Genius Infomercial Idea13:06 Jenny FAIL16:10 Not Your 9 to 5: Kennel Cough19:52 Do your resident dogs catch it?21:58 Main Topic: We're basically dog detectives23:31 Luna adopted as a puppy returned as an adult with "debilitating anxiety"29:42 Rex, an unexpectedly emaciated owner surrender38:19 Clyde (Claudette) shelter intake surprise46:54 Anti Shit List Gold Star Rescue Collabs47:46 Saving Great Animals and 8 Yorkies51:44 Yakima Valley Pet Rescue 7 Puppies56:41 Finding more fosters, fail01:01:37 This number has been disconnected01:02:57 Outro01:03:18 Behind the Scenes
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    1 h y 5 m
  • 3.2 - Senior Adopters: Balancing Limits, Hard Truths, and Potential Payoffs

    3.2 - Senior Adopters: Balancing Limits, Hard Truths, and Potential Payoffs
    Sep 22 2025

    In Episode 3.2, hosts Jenny Nordin and Ashlyn Kauh are back with another dose of chaos and candor. They kick things off in Not Your 9 to 5, celebrating their first spay/neuter clinic: 31 dogs fixed in a single day — a win for rescue, a loss for Ashlyn’s back.

    The main topic tackles adopting to seniors, and why some rescues just won’t do it. It’s not about ageism; it’s about reality — fixed incomes, mobility struggles, and the hard truth that sometimes dogs outlive their humans. Complicated? Absolutely. But also? Some of the most special homes you’ll ever find. Jenny and Ashlyn unpack the fine line between discriminating and discrimination (and why being discerning is literally part of the job), sharing tips for navigating placements with older adopters.

    On the Shit List, Jenny wades into the awkward waters of anxiety and placement regret after an adopter spiraled into panic attacks before the dog had even decompressed. (Pro-tip: it’d be nice to know ahead of time when someone’s one popped collar away from a full-blown crisis).

    Finally, in Questions, they share a few red flags and low-key red flags reading between the lines on adoption apps. Some might surprise you!

    POD MENTIONS:

    Sparks K9
    Seattle Animal Foundation
    Sardis Raptor Center
    Old Dog Haven
    2.4: Fungus Among Us -- Healing Yeasty Dogs from the Inside Out [DGS Podcast]
    The Anxious Generation (Jonathan Haidt) [Amazon]

    PARNTER MENTIONS:

    Double Down Dog Training
    Veterinary Emergency Group (VEG)
    A Dog’s Best Friend
    START Rescue
    Tail Lights Rescue Project
    Fixers Collective [Instagram]
    Saving Great Animals
    Forever Home Dog Rescue
    Seattle Veterinary Outreach
    Crossroads Vet
    Nirvana K9 Training


    ADOPTABLE DOG MENTIONS:

    Sprinkle
    Licorice
    Ramen
    Eren

    Ask us anything via Email to soyouwanttorunadogrescue@gmail.com

    Follow us on social media at @dgs.podcast

    Don't forget to Like, Share, Comment and Subscribe!

    Chapters

    00:00 3.2 Senior Adopters: Balancing Limits, Hard Truths, and Potential Payoffs

    01:59 A kid-free Anniversary weekend (ofc Jenny brought the dog)

    07:16 Updates from 3.1 and Three Awesome Adoptions

    10:13 Planning for multiple big intakes! (Finally)

    14:39 Not Your 9 to 5: Fixers Collective Spay Neuter Clinic

    25:15 Main Topic: Navigating Senior Adopters

    28:29 4 Concerns/Considerations: Mental, Physical Capacity, Fixed Income and Death Plan

    35:21 More typical challenges and positive considerations

    40:11 What about Seniors for Seniors programs?

    41:51 How do we navigate this: In person assessment, references, and difficult conversations

    45:13 Real rescue examples: Data the Cattle Dog (Denied)

    48:01 Anastasia: Vet reference check FAIL

    48:59 Halle Berry: Checked all the boxes and a perfect senior placement

    52:35 Asking the difficult question with Bear

    54:25 Grandma Margie and Lucy

    57:28 Going above and beyond and being open minded

    01:00:24 Mistakes we won't make again

    01:05:38 Key takeaways (it can be really special when you get it right)

    01:07:47 A shit list anxious generation adoption return

    01:16:25 Question: Red flags (and low-key red flags) on adoption applications
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    1 h y 23 m
  • 3.1 — Spay Aborts: The No-Brainer No-Kill Can't Handle

    3.1 — Spay Aborts: The No-Brainer No-Kill Can't Handle
    Sep 10 2025
    Season Three, LFG! In episode 1, hosts Jenny Nordin and Ashlyn Kauh dive straight into a hot-button topic: spay aborts. Why so controversial? In today’s rescue climate, it should be a no-brainer. But with big names like No-Kill Austin Pets Alive pushing a twisted, delusional narrative (and dirty-deleting their infamous video when the internet clapped back), someone’s gotta say it: we’re not sipping that Kool-Aid!Before we go full soapbox, though, in Not Your 9 to 5, we talk Strep Zoo (yep, add it to the ever-growing rescue worry list) and our 3 a.m. VEG adventure that, thankfully, had a happy ending.And yes—the Crazy Folder is back. This one’s a doozy: Ashlyn unleashes her best “howler” to deliver Tammy’s unhinged message to volunteer Juliana. Spoiler: Tammy wanted a manager. Ashlyn was more than happy to oblige. Go home, Tammy—you’re drunk. (Or just a batty bitch.)POD MENTIONS:International Association of Canine Professionals (IACP)Ivan Balabanov [Training without Conflict]Jay Jack [Next Level Dogs]Dr. Melanie Uhde [Canine Decoded]Renegade Paws RescueSUPERZOOStreptococcus zooepidemicus: an emerging canine pathogen [PubMed]Strep zoo outbreak (July 4, 2025) [Stanislaus Animal Services Facebook]Response to Austin Pets Alive video (dirty delete) [Love and Puppy Paws Dog Rescue Facebook]Commercial Breeder and Pet Store Laws by State [Bailing Out Benji]PARNTER MENTIONS:K9 Kennel BossAll the Best Pet CareDouble Down Dog TrainingVeterinary Emergency Group (VEG)Nirvana K9 TrainingStanislaus Animal ServicesThe Good Dog WayCrossroads VetADOPTABLE DOG MENTIONS: SprinkleSundaeEugeneLunchSnackAsk us anything via Email to soyouwanttorunadogrescue@gmail.comFollow us on social media at @dgs.podcastDon't forget to Like, Share, Comment and Subscribe!Chapters00:00 3.1 Spay Abort03:46 IACP key takeaways08:00 Really exciting announcement (podcast guest)09:36 Superzoo slip lead search13:54 Household updates, kids and dogs21:50 Dogs and kids (stress inoculation)23:21 Not Your 9 to 5: Strep Zoo scare25:32 Another gold star for VEG26:52 Context: Heidi the GSD31:02 Main Topic: Spay Abort in Shelters and Rescues32:25 Austin Pets Alive Anti-Spay Abort Message (and Dirty Delete)35:36 Love and Puppy Paws Dog Rescue Response (Accurate)37:02 Ashlyn's comment (mic drop)38:40 The problems with the puppies40:18 What is best for the moms anyway?43:02 Our policy: Spay abort if safe47:41 Thank goodness for our vet50:11 Crazy Folder: Karen's cousin Tammy55:14 Ashlyn's HR hat57:09 Coming up in season 358:30 Q1 - How do you know if a pet store is a puppy mill?01:00:42 Q2 - How do you name all the dogs?01:05:11 Good vibes signing off01:06:13 Behind the scenes with Sally's farts
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    1 h y 7 m
  • 2.29: Scrotal Hematoma (aka Swollen Empty Ball Sac Syndrome)

    2.29: Scrotal Hematoma (aka Swollen Empty Ball Sac Syndrome)
    Aug 15 2025
    Season Two Finale! In episode 29, hosts Jenny Nordin and Ashlyn Kauh gear up for a week in Savannah at the IACP conference—with two husbands and five young kids in tow. Between the usual chaos and conference prep, they share rescue updates and dive into the saga of Enzo’s, ahem, “ball situation” (medically: scrotal hematoma). This inspires a slightly uncomfortable trip down rescue memory lane, featuring legends like Dicer the Doberman and Pepsi, the infamous Giving Tuesday tearjerker. This one is a short, sweet, and delightfully awkward episode that might have you wondering what it’s like to ice your dog’s bits. Par for the course of a day in the life!POD MENTIONS:International Association of Canine Professionals (IACP)The Sprinkler Game [The Collared Scholar You Tube]Scrotal Hematoma [Veterinary Key Points]Von Willebrand Disease [Cornell]Crate Breaking Prevention [The Good Dog Way]Duke Ferguson [Unleashed Potential]Melanie Uhde [Canine Decoded]Dog Pro Radio Podcast [IACP]Episode 16: Jay Jack [Dog Pro Radio]PARNTER MENTIONS:Double Down Dog TrainingFurry Freight Shelter TransportTail Lights Rescue ProjectCrossroads VetK9 Kennel BossADOPTABLE DOG MENTIONS: SundaeCleoFranklinEnzoAsk us anything via Email to soyouwanttorunadogrescue@gmail.comFollow us on social media at @dgs.podcastDon't forget to Like, Share, Comment and Subscribe!Chapters00:00 2.29 Scrotal Hematoma02:38 Rescue center updates03:51 First training seminar and it's engagement games07:51 Two stars and a wish08:45 Dog updates13:30 Still looking for skeletons in Franklin's closet15:14 Empty swollen ball sac syndrome aka scrotal hematoma17:38 What even is it and what are risk factors20:12 Caring for a dog with scrotal hematoma24:37 When ablation is necessary26:31 Vet dynamics with 'botched' surgeries29:58 Most memorable scrotal hematomas30:45 Bruno the GSD going to Canada circa 201732:21 Probably the worst: Dicer the Doberman35:14 Ashlyn's worst case: Archer, also a Doberman37:14 Pepsi the Giving Tuesday Poster Boy38:37 Considerations for Shadowfax39:34 Heading to IACP Conference in Savannah41:57 Excited to see Melanie Uhde (Canine Decoded)44:35 Jay Jack Windows Theory49:29 Future of the Podcast: Season 3!51:16 Deleted Scenes and ADHD Tangents
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    53 m