A CMO Confidential Interview with Jim Lecinski, Clinical Professor of Marketing at the Kellogg School of Management, two time author, and former Google VP. Jim discusses the need to teach both durable and perishable knowledge, the importance of faculty composition, why students should "sample" B-Schools, and how the Northwestern "House Design" keeps it ranked as the #1 marketing school. We go inside the Insomnia Cookies Case which uses GOST (Goals, Objectives, Strategy and Tactics) and 70/20/10 to train students on driving revenue, profit and market share. Tune in to hear why you shouldn't be a "Tumbleweed" and instead strive to "Meet the universe halfway."

A CMO Confidential Interview with Jim Lecinski, Clinical Professor of Marketing at The Kellogg School of Management, 2-time author and former Google VP. Jim discusses the need to teach both durable and perishable knowledge, the importance of faculty composition, why students should "sample" B-Schools, and how the Northwestern "House Design" keeps it ranked #1 in marketing. We go inside the Insomnia Cookies Case which uses GOST (Goals, Objectives, Strategy and Tactics) and 70/20/10 to train students on driving revenue, profit and market share. Tune in to hear why you shouldn't be a "Tumbleweed" and instead strive to "Meet the universe halfway."

00:00 – Welcome & Intro

Mike introduces Jim Lecinski, his background at Google and Northwestern, and tees up today’s topic: The Insomnia Cookies Case and the GOST model.

03:42 – From Google to the Classroom

Jim shares the story of Eric Schmidt’s advice to “teach, don’t pitch”—a philosophy that reshaped his approach to marketing and led to academia.

07:25 – Are Business Schools Outdated?

Jim responds to critiques that MBA programs lag behind marketing’s evolution. He introduces the idea of durable vs. perishable marketing knowledge.

12:10 – What Makes Northwestern Different

A deep dive into how Kellogg blends academic and practical knowledge through its marketing strategy curriculum and clinical faculty.

16:32 – The Insomnia Cookies Case

Jim explains why Insomnia Cookies became a great example of strategic growth thinking—and what other brands can learn from it.

20:48 – Introducing the GOST Model

Using GOST (Goals, Objectives, Strategies, Tactics), Jim unpacks how Insomnia grew revenue 3x through disciplined planning, not buzz or virality.

28:55 – The 70/20/10 Growth Framework

How Insomnia balanced core product expansion, adjacent markets (like vegan cookies), and new categories (ice cream) to create sustainable momentum.

33:30 – Avoiding the “Gold Mine” Trap

Why companies rush into adjacent businesses (like Peloton did) and how to model your way out of distraction and back to core growth.

39:14 – How Kellogg Stays #1 in Marketing

The role of clinical faculty, student engagement, and a culture of “yes, and” in maintaining relevance in a fast-changing field.

42:00 – Advice for Aspiring Marketers Choosing B-Schools

Jim outlines what to look for when evaluating a program—beyond the rankings and websites.

46:10 – Meet the Universe Halfway: Career Advice + Jazz Story

Jim’s closing advice for career success, plus an embarrassing moment involving jazz legend Wynton Marsalis.

49:25 – Wrap-up & Where to Listen Next

Mike closes the show and directs listeners to other relevant episodes on CLTV, Peloton, Budweiser, and Warby Parker.

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