You've poured your heart into developing your game, a publisher shows interest, and suddenly you're staring at a contract full of terms you've never heard of. Our guest today is there to help you in that situation.

To kick off our brand-new format Behind the Build, Sarah sits down with René Otto, attorney and founder of Deviant Legal, a law firm built entirely for the games industry. René works with over 300 developers and publishers, and he's written a free, 20,000-word guide to help indie devs actually understand what they're signing.

You can get the guide here - no strings attached: https://deviantlegal.com/guide/game-developers-guide-publishing-agreements/

They break down the clauses that matter most: royalties, recoupment traps, perpetual licenses, and the confusing world of first negotiation, first refusal, and last refusal. René explains not just what these terms mean, but how they quietly work together and why a deal that looks fine on the surface can cost you everything.

Plus: the publisher who hid Easter eggs in their contract template, the developer who lost both their money and their game in a single deal, and why some publishers get suspicious when you don't negotiate.

A must-listen for any indie dev who's ever received a publishing offer, dreamed of one, or just wants to know what they're getting into before signing on the dotted line.

Episode Timestamps:
Intro: 0:00
Guest Intro: 1:38
Topic Overview: 5:48
Guide for Publishing Agreements: 12:26
Typical Red Flags: 15:08
Typical Legal Terms: 19:55
Important Sections in the Guide: 27:30
Owning IP Rights: 33:27
Negotiating Money: 36:05
Crafting Milestones: 42:33
Dealing with License Fees: 46:26
Handling Marketing: 49:28
Community Questions: 54:56
Example of a Great Publisher: 1:06:04
A Guide for Devs Worldwide: 1:09:24
Making Contracts More Accessible: 1:10:29
How René Became a Video Game Lawyer: 1:12:21
René's Law Firm: 1:19:48
The Pros and Cons of Being a Lawyer: 1:28:24
Sending a Message Back in Time: 1:31:25
Memorable Career Moments: 1:35:03
Advice for Devs Looking for a Publisher: 1:39:41
René's Next Steps: 1:42:31
Outro: 1:44:59

As always, have fun listening! If you like what we do, tell your friends (and enemies) about us.

Sarah & iV sit down once again for a cozy chat about the indie games they really enjoyed playing in 2025 and the games they're most looking forward to in 2026.

If you're looking for great indie games to play, give the ones mentioned here a shot. We're pretty sure you won't regret it.

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EPISODE TIMESTAMPS
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TypInc.: 0:25
Blue Prince: 10:03
Keep Driving: 20:48
Dredge: 29:46
Vikings on Trampolines: 37:51
Shroom and Gloom: 41:50
Outro: 46:52

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GAMES FEATURED
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⌨️ TypInc.
Developer: Game Game Games
Genre: Deckbuilder Typing Game
https://store.steampowered.com/app/3230090/TypInc/

👑 Blue Prince
Developer: Dogubomb
Genre: Strategy Roguelike Puzzle Adventure
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1569580/Blue_Prince/

🚗 Keep Driving
Developer: Y/CJ/Y
Genre: Management RPG
https://store.steampowered.com/app/2756920/Keep_Driving/

🎣 Dredge
Developer: Black Salt Games
Genre: Mystery Fishing Strategy Adventure
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1562430/DREDGE/

🛝 Vikings on Trampolines
Developer: D-Pad Studio
Genre: Co-op Party Game
https://store.steampowered.com/app/748810/Vikings_On_Trampolines/

🍄 Shroom and Gloom
Developer: Team Lazerbeam
Genre: Card-based Roguelike Strategy
https://store.steampowered.com/app/3271280/Shroom_and_Gloom/

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What were the games you loved in 2025? Did our recommendations help you discover your next favorite game? We'd love to know!

If you like what we do, tell your friends (and enemies) about our show!

In this episode, we are trying something new! Instead of our usual developer interviews, Sarah and iV are sitting down to give you a dedicated review and deep dive into the unique indie gem, Cryptmaster.

We spent 30+ hours snooping around dungeons, typing frantically, and laughing at the Cryptmaster’s insults so you don't have to (but you definitely should).

Episode Timestamps:

The Cryptmaster is back: 0:00

Why this episode: 0:46

What is Cryptmaster: 1:30

The devs: 2:02

Gameplay mechanics: 2:45

Typing for treasure: 6:38

What makes it special: 8:18

Developing Cryptmaster: 11:06

Magic moments: 13:44

Conclusion: 17:48

Your thoughts: 19:33

The New Format: Why we are shifting gears to talk gameplay and personal reviews.

The Mechanics: How playing a game only with a keyboard (no mouse!) creates a frantic, fun, and immersive experience.

Real-Time vs. Turn-Based: The stress (and joy) of typing "HIT" or "ZAP" before a mosquito bites you.

Behind the Scenes: The fascinating story of how Cryptmaster originally started as a pirate game.

Voice Acting: How developer Lee Williams ended up voicing the sarcastic Cryptmaster himself.

Magic Moments: How not to Tomb Raid

Game Info:

Game: Cryptmaster

Developers: Paul Hart & Lee Williams

Genre: Dungeon Crawler Puzzle Adventure

Platforms: PC & Consoles

Links & Resources:

Full Interview with Developer Lee Williams: Episode #42

Find us here

Have you played Cryptmaster? Type your favorite word in the comments.

If you like what we do, tell your friends (and enemies) about our show!