This interview covers pioneering work by Rotherham Council to develop a local ecosystem of social and micro enterprises to maximise outcomes for people with a learning disability and autistic people.

Some considered it brave or bold to put faith in micro and social emterpises to develop an extensive "offer" (of excellent services which reflect a person’s interests and passions, not their disability) as the council moved away from building-based services.

But the results speak for themselves, as you can hear from Nathan. The programme has been a "fantastic contributor to Rotherham Council's commitment to social value." It has also created more than 100 new jobs in Rotherham.

A "partnership" approach was a critical success factor. How did the council and its partner, Community Catalysts, create and nurture an environment where both social and micro-enterprises would flourish? And how does the programme support independence and offer affordable, personalised services that people want to choose? Nathan explains.

He believes social enterprises are purpose-aligned, natural partners to local authorities and he tells us why in this episode. And he has great ideas about what can we do to turn exemplars such as this into a movement across the UK.

Nathan is now Corporate Director of Adults and Wellbeing at Trafford Council, a role he took up in January 2023, and formerly Assistant Director of Strategic Commissioning in Adult Care, Housing and Public Health at Rotherham Metropolitan Borough Council. We recorded this interview before Nathan left Rotherham and joined Trafford.

What next?

• Nathan has written a chapter for Vitalising Purpose – The Power of the Social Enterprise Difference in Public Services.
• A 'must-read for chief executives, heads of transformation, commissioners and procurement officers, and social entrepreneurs,' the book is available in paperback and ebook formats here: https://e3m.org.uk/vitalising-purpose-book/
• And from Amazon here ( https://amzn.eu/d/6f25KJB )

"Probably, lawyers are most responsible for some of the non-progressive aspects of how we deal with public services at the moment," says today's guest, a lawyer.

Julian Blake is a partner at Stone King and co-author of the widely acclaimed 2016 publication, The Art of the Possible in Public Procurement. For over 30 years, he has specialised in social enterprise, charity, responsible business, public service reform and innovation, co-operatives and stakeholder participation – blending business and public benefit legal disciplines.

"The law compounds the failures in facilitating and applying practical frameworks for public service commissioning," writes Julian in the new book, Vitalising Purpose.

"It is deferred to as rigid authority too much and applied purposively too little. The technical lawyer is too dominant and the practical lawyer too underemployed." So what advice can this practical-minded and expert lawyer give us? Plenty. We cover:

• How things have changed since The Art of the Possible in Public Procurement was published in 2016.
• Organisations Julian admires for commissioning progressively, with examples of multi-stakeholder, purpose-aligned partnerships.
• The difference between public value and social value.
• "Social Value Imperatives" and how commissioners and public authorities can use them.
• Open book accounting in public service delivery.
• More public authorities are creating Innovation Partnerships, or entities equivalent to them, since trailblazers and pioneers did so.
• What the future looks like with a new Procurement Bill (and associated Guidance) coming.

What next?

• Visit the Stone King website: https://www.stoneking.co.uk
• Julian has written a chapter for Vitalising Purpose – The Power of the Social Enterprise Difference in Public Services.
• A 'must-read for chief executives, heads of transformation, commissioners and procurement officers, and social entrepreneurs,' the book is available in paperback and ebook formats here: https://e3m.org.uk/vitalising-purpose-book/
• And from Amazon here ( https://amzn.eu/d/6f25KJB )
• The Art of the Possible in Public Procurement, co-written by Julian Blake and Frank Villeneuve, is available here: https://e3m.org.uk/the-art-of-the-possible-in-public-procurement/
• Part 1 Consultation on draft regulations to implement the Procurement Bill (which closes on 28 July 2023).

It's often assumed that people across an organisation understand what impact measurement is. But impact is about much, much more than "putting fancy numbers in reports." Next level impact measurement and management maximises social value and today's guest explains how.

Heidi Fisher MBE has worked for over two decades in impact measurement and management. As founder and CEO of Make an Impact CIC she has supported thousands of social enterprises, from start-ups to those with over £1 billion in income.

She does lots of impact measurement and management work with NHS Trusts and foundations, and with social enterprises which work with them.

A qualified accountant, she finds impact measurement work "much more interesting and fun." We cover:

• Three essential ingredients of impact measurement and management.
• Five ways to embed impact in your organisation.
• Common challenges organisations have in measuring and managing their impact, and how to address these.
• The impact of better and more effective impact measurement and management, in terms of maximising social value, creating better outcomes for people, improving staff morale, involvement and wellbeing, and creating better value for money.

What next?

• Visit the Make an Impact CIC website: https://makeanimpactcic.co.uk
• Heidi has written a chapter for Vitalising Purpose – The Power of the Social Enterprise Difference in Public Services.
• A 'must-read for chief executives, heads of transformation, commissioners and procurement officers, and social entrepreneurs,' the book is available in paperback and ebook formats here: https://e3m.org.uk/vitalising-purpose-book/
• And from Amazon here ( https://amzn.eu/d/6f25KJB )
• Heidi's book, Impact First, is available here https://makeanimpactcic.co.uk/about-2/my-book-impact-first/