In this deeply honest and meaningful conversation, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaels explore one of the most important—and often avoided—topics in healing: personal pain.

Whether that pain feels overwhelming and present, or buried and difficult to access, it plays a powerful role in shaping how we think, feel, and connect with others. In this episode, we examine how early life experiences—especially Adverse Childhood Experiences (ACEs)—can influence emotional health, physical well-being, and relationship patterns later in life.

Dr. Skinner shares both clinical insights and personal experiences to illustrate how unresolved pain can remain stored in the body for years, quietly influencing behavior and perception. Together, we discuss why some experiences are difficult to recall, how trauma impacts the brain and nervous system, and why having a safe, supportive environment is essential for healing.

This episode also offers hope. Through the concept of Benevolent Childhood Experiences (BCEs), we explore how even one positive, supportive relationship can shift outcomes and foster resilience. Healing is possible—and it often begins with awareness, compassion, and a willingness to gently explore your story.

If you’ve ever felt stuck, overwhelmed, or unsure why certain patterns keep repeating, this episode is an invitation to better understand yourself—and to take the next step toward healing.

• Adverse Childhood Experiences (ACEs) Assessment A 10-item framework for understanding early life adversity and its long-term impact.

• Benevolent Childhood Experiences (BCEs) A complementary framework highlighting the protective power of positive early relationships.

• The Deepest Well by Nadine Burke Harris Explores how childhood adversity impacts lifelong health and how healing is possible.

• The Body Keeps the Score by Bessel van der Kolk A foundational resource on how trauma is stored in the body and approaches to healing.

• Trauma-Informed Modalities Mentioned

  • EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing)

  • Somatic-based approaches to trauma recovery

If this topic resonates with you, we invite you to explore more through the Human Intimacy community:

• Watch sessions from our recent conference: Human Intimacy Conference (Past Event Highlights & Resources)

• Learn more about courses, assessments, and tools for healing and connection: HumanIntimacy.com

Your story matters. And while it may feel difficult to look at the past, understanding your experiences can become one of the most powerful steps toward freedom, healing, and deeper connection.

If you feel overwhelmed, we encourage you to seek support from a qualified professional. You don’t have to do this work alone.

In this episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner and Marianne Michaelis explore the many forms of courage required in the healing process—both individually and as a couple.

Courage is not just about staying in a relationship after betrayal. It’s about facing pain, telling the truth, asking for help, and being willing to see yourself clearly. It’s the courage to slow down when emotions are overwhelming, to remain present in difficult conversations, and to confront shame rather than avoid it.

Dr. Skinner and Marianne highlight how healing is not just emotional—it is deeply biological. When individuals feel shame or fear, their nervous system becomes activated, making it difficult to stay grounded and connected. True courage, then, is learning how to regulate those internal responses so that meaningful repair can happen.

Through powerful metaphors—including riding through dark tunnels, wearing the wrong “lens,” and learning to ride a backwards bike—they illustrate how healing requires patience, intentionality, and repeated effort. Change often feels unnatural at first, but with practice, new patterns can emerge.

Ultimately, this episode invites listeners to reflect on one essential question:

Where do I need courage right now?

Healing is not about perfection—it’s about continuing forward, even when the path is unclear.

• Healing from betrayal requires multiple forms of courage—not just endurance, but self-awareness and vulnerability

• Shame is both emotional and physiological; regulation must come before meaningful connection

• Slowing down is sometimes more courageous than pushing forward

• Change feels unnatural at first—like using your non-dominant hand or riding a backwards bike

• Progress happens through repetition, curiosity, and compassionate self-reflection

• Each person’s pace is different—comparison can disrupt healing

• Human Intimacy Website (Courses & Conference Access): https://www.humanintimacy.com

• 2026 Human Intimacy Conference (Recordings Available): Available under “Courses” after creating a free account

• Contact for Questions: info@humanintimacy.com

• Intimacy Repair Method (IRM) – Dr. Kevin Skinner

• Polyvagal Theory – Dr. Stephen Porges

• Shame & Vulnerability Research – Brené Brown

• Interpersonal Neurobiology – Dr. Dan Siegel

• EMDR & Trauma Processing Models

• The Backwards Brain Bicycle (Learning & Change): A powerful illustration of how difficult it is to rewire learned patterns

• Where in my life do I need courage right now?

• What am I avoiding because it feels uncomfortable or overwhelming?

• When I feel triggered or flooded, how do I typically respond?

• What would it look like to slow down instead of react?

• Where have I already demonstrated courage in my healing journey?

In this episode of the Human Intimacy Podcast, Dr. Kevin Skinner and MaryAnn Michaelis reflect on the powerful insights emerging from the 2026 Human Intimacy Conference, with a particular focus on grief following sexual betrayal. While much of the field has emphasized trauma and post-traumatic stress, this conversation highlights a critical gap: the profound and often unaddressed grief experienced by both betrayed and betraying partners.

Drawing from early data on the Grief After Betrayal Impact Scale, MaryAnn shares a striking finding—the most significant loss reported is not just the relationship, but the loss of self, including identity, trust in oneself, and a coherent sense of reality. The discussion explores how betrayal creates a “collapsed self,” alters one’s perception of a partner, and leads to ongoing grief that can persist for decades.

The episode introduces emerging frameworks for understanding betrayal-related grief, including stages of emotional shock, internal conflict, withdrawal, rage, and eventual reclamation. Dr. Skinner and Marianne emphasize that grief is not a single event but a long-term process, often unfolding over years as individuals grieve not only what happened, but what could have been.

A key theme is the importance of giving grief a voice in safe relationships. Healing is accelerated when individuals are witnessed, validated, and supported—whether by a partner, therapist, or trusted connection. Without this, grief often becomes prolonged and isolating.

The conversation also raises important clinical and societal implications, including the need for better training, expanded research, and more effective support systems—particularly in faith communities, where many individuals report feeling misunderstood or unsupported.

Ultimately, this episode reframes betrayal recovery by integrating grief as a central component of healing, calling for a more compassionate, relational, and research-informed approach to addressing the deep emotional losses that accompany betrayal.

Click here to take the Grief After Betrayal Impact Scale

(Note: These are foundational and aligned with concepts discussed in the episode—ideal for podcast notes and future academic integration.)

1. Jennifer J. Freyd (1996). Betrayal Trauma: The Logic of Forgetting Childhood Abuse. Harvard University Press.

2. Judith Herman (1992). Trauma and Recovery. Basic Books.

3. Susan Anderson (2010). The Journey from Abandonment to Healing. Berkley Books.

4. Elisabeth Kübler-Ross & Kessler, D. (2005). On Grief and Grieving. Scribner.

5. William Worden (2009). Grief Counseling and Grief Therapy. Springer Publishing.

6. Bessel van der Kolk (2014). The Body Keeps the Score. Viking.

7. Stephen W. Porges (2011). The Polyvagal Theory. Norton.

8. John Bowlby (1980). Attachment and Loss: Vol. 3 – Loss. Basic Books.

9. Pauline Boss (1999). Ambiguous Loss. Harvard University Press.

10. Kenneth J. Doka (1989). Disenfranchised Grief. Lexington Books.