Whenever I think of incomprehensible demoralization, I think of this episode... just the bafflement at the inability to stop and the inability to imagine a life without it....

but he makes it throughhhhhh!!!!

Sometimes, it's amazing to me that with all my privileges and advantages I've still struggled to make it through this life. And yet my next guest is a guy who really had none of that - absentee parents running from their own mess inflicting their trauma on their poorskids. And somehow he found a way through - a way that was aided and abetted by drug and alcohol abuse - but a way nonetheless. He has two books out now The Wisdom of the Rooms and The Twelve Steps: A Modern Hero's journey which the kirkus review called unexpectedly gripping. Won't you please welcome, Michael Z.

Buy his book here: https://a.co/d/itIECxR

When I was an assistant at William Morris my boss would sometimes hire this masseuse - Steve - to come into the office and give everyone neck and shoulder massages. And he would laugh that my session was always a kind of wrestling match. "Nick, relax," he'd say. "This is meant to be enjoyable!" This next interview feels a little bit like that. We wrestle for a rhythm that works, but somehow get there in the end. My next guest was a drug dealer for decades, ran a recovery film film festival, founded the experience strength and hope awards and has a new book out, now: High From Cannabis to Clarity. Won't you please welcome Leonard Lee Buschel.