Designer, craftsman, artist and educator, Norman Teague, grew up in Chicago absorbing the sounds, colors, textures and vibes of his “hood,” fancy cars, and Auntie Aretha’s painting. A highschool Drafting elective was his first real step into the design field, which he then traversed with aplomb through an MFA at SAIC, to the Venice Architecture Biennale, to MoMA, to the design team of the Obama Presidential Center. At the helm of his namesake design studio, he’s built a storied, critically acclaimed career, and a powerful legacy of challenging the design canon, cultural storytelling, and educating generations of future designers.

Images and more from Norman Teague on our website!

Special thanks to our sponsor: Wix Studio is a platform built for all web creators to design, develop, and manage exceptional web projects at scale.

Clever is hosted & produced by Amy Devers, with editing by Mark Zurawinski, production assistance from Ilana Nevins and Anouchka Stephan, and music by El Ten Eleven.

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Chief Creative Officer of Bruce Mau Design, Laura Stein grew up on Nun’s Island outside of Montreal, a near utopia where kids never had to cross the street. Her psychiatrist father and museum-involved mother cultivated curiosity about emotions, critical thinking, and the arts. A move to Texas in her teens resulted in quite a culture shock. Laura found an innate knack for peer reviews and analysis, which became a strength throughout the rest of her academic and professional career. Originally graduating with a degree in English, she returned to school to study art, where she found not only her community, but her band mates. From there, it was a wild ride - record signing (Sub Pop,) touring, and navigating all the ups and downs of being in a girl band in the ‘90s – the ultimate creative boot camp. Now in leadership at Bruce Mau Design, she’s deploying the wisdom garnered from all these experiences to build a culture focused on keeping possibility alive.

Images and more from Laura Stein on our website!

Special thanks to our sponsor! Wix Studio is a platform built for all web creators to design, develop, and manage exceptional web projects at scale.

Clever is hosted & produced by Amy Devers, with editing by Mark Zurawinski, production assistance from Ilana Nevins and Anouchka Stephan, and music by El Ten Eleven.

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Special thanks to our sponsors!

• Wix Studio is a platform built for all web creators to design, develop, and manage exceptional web projects at scale.
• Sub-Zero, Wolf, and Cove's Kitchen Design Contest is a global design competition celebrating outstanding kitchen design projects. Apply now!

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For over 40+ years, Mick De Giulio has been dedicating his talents to designing kitchens that sing. It all starts with listening, and the results are masterpieces of flow, proportion, beauty, utility and emotional resonance. A devotee of craft, he’s known for having an unusual command of detail and materials. He brings it all together in service of designing dynamic shared spaces that foster connection, care and magic moments. The author of two books, Kitchen Centric and Kitchen, with a third out in 2026, he is an unmatched leader in the field who also supports the industry and elevates the art of kitchen design by way of the Sub-Zero, Wolf and Cove Kitchen Design Contest.

Images and more from Mick De Giulio on our website!

Thanks to Sub-Zero Wolf and Cove for sponsoring this episode! Learn more about the Kitchen Design Contest and submit your application here: https://www.subzero-wolf.com/trade-resources/kitchen-design-contest

Clever is hosted & produced by Amy Devers, with editing by Mark Zurawinski, production assistance from Ilana Nevins and Anouchka Stephan, and music by El Ten Eleven.

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Special thanks to our sponsors!

• Wix Studio is a platform built for all web creators to design, develop, and manage exceptional web projects at scale.
• Sub-Zero, Wolf, and Cove's Kitchen Design Contest is a global design competition celebrating outstanding kitchen design projects. Apply now!

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Cas Holman grew up playing make-believe in the woods and helping her mechanic step-dad fix cars and dune buggies. Always knowing that she didn’t check the stereotypical gender boxes, she never gave any of the other arbitrary “boxes” much credit either, instead preferring to focus on the outside-the-box possibilities that could be accessed through play, curiosity, and exploration. While getting her MFA, she began working on Geemo, a building toy, which kicked-off her life’s mission of designing for play. Since then, she’s established herself as a champion of open-ended play, designing notable play systems like Rigamajig. She’s worked with global business leaders to incorporate play into company culture, leading to more innovative outcomes, greater trust and safety, and improved resilience. With her upcoming book, Playful, she is on a campaign to help adults reconnect with play throughout their lives because she knows, and has the research and science to prove it, that with play we ALL become more creative, joyful, and productive. Ain’t that good news!

Images and more from Cas Holman on our website!

Special thanks to our sponsor: Wix Studio is a platform built for all web creators to design, develop, and manage exceptional web projects at scale.

Clever is hosted & produced by Amy Devers, with editing by Mark Zurawinski, production assistance from Ilana Nevins and Anouchka Stephan, and music by El Ten Eleven.

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Special thanks to our sponsors!

• Wix Studio is a platform built for all web creators to design, develop, and manage exceptional web projects at scale.
• Sub-Zero, Wolf, and Cove's Kitchen Design Contest is a global design competition celebrating outstanding kitchen design projects. Apply now!

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Bradley L. Bowers spent his youth hanging in the basement with Grandma Dorothy while she upholstered furniture. Always outspoken, in high school he found that only the art teachers embraced his questioning of the status quo. A fruitful spell at SCAD earned him Industrial & Furniture Design degrees + loads of skills, but it’s by tuning his antenna to the ‘little Yodas everywhere’ that he gathers his wisdom.

Images, links and more from Bradley on cleverpodcast.com!

Special thanks to our sponsor! Wix Studio is a platform built for all web creators to design, develop, and manage exceptional web projects at scale.

Clever is hosted & produced by Amy Devers, with editing by Mark Zurawinski, production assistance from Ilana Nevins and Anouchka Stephan, and music by El Ten Eleven.

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SIGN UP - for our Substack for news, bonus content, new episode alerts

VISIT - cleverpodcast.com for transcripts, images, and 200+ more episodes

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Special thanks to our sponsors!

• Wix Studio is a platform built for all web creators to design, develop, and manage exceptional web projects at scale.
• Sub-Zero, Wolf, and Cove's Kitchen Design Contest is a global design competition celebrating outstanding kitchen design projects. Apply now!

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Designer, researcher and author Ingrid Fetell Lee spent her childhood traveling back and forth between divorced parents, indulging her curiosity during unstructured time, and losing herself in books and her journal. Her professional path routed her through creative writing, market research and industrial design on the way to dedicating her life to the study of joy, and helping people understand the very profound effects our surroundings have on our well-being. It’s powerful and paradigm-shifting work!

Images and more from Ingrid on cleverpodcast.com!

Special thanks to our sponsor! Wix Studio is a platform built for all web creators to design, develop, and manage exceptional web projects at scale.

This episode of Clever is created, hosted and produced by Amy Devers and Jaime Derringer with music from El Ten Eleven and editing by Rich Stroffolino.

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Special thanks to our sponsors!

• Wix Studio is a platform built for all web creators to design, develop, and manage exceptional web projects at scale.
• Sub-Zero, Wolf, and Cove's Kitchen Design Contest is a global design competition celebrating outstanding kitchen design projects. Apply now!

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

For over 40+ years, Mick De Giulio has been dedicating his talents to designing kitchens that sing. It all starts with listening, and the results are masterpieces of flow, proportion, beauty, utility and emotional resonance. A devotee of craft, he’s known for having an unusual command of detail and materials. He brings it all together in service of designing dynamic shared spaces that foster connection, care and magic moments. The author of two books, Kitchen Centric and Kitchen, with a third out in 2026, he is an unmatched leader in the field who also supports the industry and elevates the art of kitchen design by way of the Sub-Zero, Wolf and Cove Kitchen Design Contest.

Images and more from Mick De Giulio on our website!

Thanks to Sub-Zero Wolf and Cove for sponsoring this episode! Learn more about the Kitchen Design Contest and submit your application here: https://www.subzero-wolf.com/trade-resources/kitchen-design-contest

Clever is hosted & produced by Amy Devers, with editing by Mark Zurawinski, production assistance from Ilana Nevins and Anouchka Stephan, and music by El Ten Eleven.

SUBSCRIBE - listen to Clever on any podcast app!

SIGN UP - for our Substack for news, bonus content, new episode alerts

VISIT - cleverpodcast.com for transcripts, images, and 200+ more episodes

SAY HI! - on Instagram & LinkedIn @cleverpodcast @amydevers

Special thanks to our sponsors!

• Wix Studio is a platform built for all web creators to design, develop, and manage exceptional web projects at scale.
• Sub-Zero, Wolf, and Cove's Kitchen Design Contest is a global design competition celebrating outstanding kitchen design projects. Apply now!

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Designer Liz Ogbu grew up in Oakland as the daughter of Nigerian immigrants, but it wasn’t until her first trip to Nigeria at 16 that she grasped the profound role place, family, and cultural context play in shaping who we are—and what we create. Drawn to the creative possibilities of architecture, she studied both architecture and engineering before traveling across Africa on a Watson Fellowship, an experience that sharpened her understanding of who her work is ultimately for: the people most impacted by design.

Today, Liz is catalyzing what design can do—in transforming informal marketplaces, helping communities heal after being fractured by freeways, and weaving practices of grief, accountability, and repair into the built environment. Her work transcends traditional architecture, centering the excavation of harm and the pursuit of more empathetic, community-rooted design at a moment when it’s needed more than ever.

Images and more from Liz Ogbu on our website!

Special thanks to our sponsor! Wix Studio is a platform built for all web creators to design, develop, and manage exceptional web projects at scale.

Clever is hosted & produced by Amy Devers, with editing by Mark Zurawinski, production assistance from Ilana Nevins and Anouchka Stephan, and music by El Ten Eleven.

SUBSCRIBE - listen to Clever on any podcast app!

SIGN UP - for our Substack for news, bonus content, new episode alerts

VISIT - cleverpodcast.com for transcripts, images, and 200+ more episodes

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Special thanks to our sponsors!

• Wix Studio is a platform built for all web creators to design, develop, and manage exceptional web projects at scale.
• Sub-Zero, Wolf, and Cove's Kitchen Design Contest is a global design competition celebrating outstanding kitchen design projects. Apply now!

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.