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X's and Joe's

X's and Joe's

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X's and Joe's, part of the Back Home Network, is a podcast that lets you eavesdrop on an ongoing, 25-year conversation between two friends and Indiana University grads who have an unusual passion for exploring the formula for winning in today’s modern college basketball.

Hosted by Bob Moats (cbobmoats) and Mike Wiemuth (iu-in-philly), this show examines trends in recruiting, metrics, strategy, and coaching -- with an emphasis on debunking myths and challenging popular assumptions.

And while Bob and Mike's rooting interests may lie with the Hoosiers, this show takes an expansive view of the college basketball landscape beyond just Bloomington.

In other words, it's a show for ALL serious college hoops fans who truly appreciate the nuances of the sport.

© Back Home Network 2023 Baloncesto
Episodios
  • [34] Negative Recruiting -- Does It Really Work?

    [34] Negative Recruiting -- Does It Really Work?
    Jul 14 2025

    Bob Moats and Mike Wiemuth dive deep into the shadowy world of negative recruiting in college basketball, exploring the tactics, effectiveness, and ethics of programs steering players away from rival schools.


    Main Topics

    Sports Dead Period & Pacers Reflection

    [00:00-15:00]

    Bob and Mike discuss the dreaded summer sports lull and reflect on the Indiana Pacers' surprising playoff run. They examine the team's selfless ball movement, Tyrese Haliburton's devastating injury, and what the season meant for bringing fans back to NBA basketball after years away.


    Negative Recruiting Parallels to Politics

    [15:00-25:00]

    Drawing parallels to political campaigning, Bob and Mike establish how negative recruiting works as a persuasion contest. They discuss:

    • Key differences between political ads and recruiting (multiple "candidates," shadow operations)
    • The concept of "kamikaze" recruiting to prevent rivals from landing recruits
    • Strategic timing of when to go negative in recruitment battles

    The Intelligence Game

    [25:00-35:00]

    The conversation turns to how programs gather intelligence on recruits and families. Topics include:

    • Assistant coaches' extensive networks and relationship-building
    • Understanding family dynamics and decision-makers
    • The role of third-party surrogates like AAU coaches
    • How specific intel can get (down to restaurant preferences)

    Variables & Vulnerabilities

    [35:00-45:00]

    Using a comprehensive list of recruiting factors, they explore how different variables create opportunities for negative recruiting. The discussion covers playing time, facilities, academics, party scene, geography, and more, emphasizing how each recruit's priorities differ dramatically.


    The Scott Drew vs. Bob Knight Story

    [45:00-55:00]

    Bob and Mike recount the legendary bathroom confrontation where Bob Knight cornered Scott Drew over negative recruiting materials. This story illustrates the tensions between established programs and upstart challengers trying to disrupt the recruiting landscape.


    Player Compensation Era & IU's Fresh Start

    [55:00-End]

    The discussion shifts to how NIL has changed recruiting dynamics and examines IU's situation under the new coaching staff. They analyze recent comments about fan expectations and how confident leadership can address external criticism.

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    1 h y 30 m
  • [33] Rally Behind The Bison (with Galen Clavio and Cooper Tinsley)

    [33] Rally Behind The Bison (with Galen Clavio and Cooper Tinsley)
    Jun 30 2025

    Bob Moats and Mike Wiemuth are joined by Dr. Galen Clavio and former IU Student Body President Cooper Tinsley to explore how the bison mascot made its return to Indiana University.


    A Historic Recording Setup

    [00:00-05:00]

    A first for the show - recording with Cooper calling in from Paris during his study abroad. Cooper served as IU's 77th Student Body President after transferring from Alabama, where he only lasted one semester before realizing IU was where he belonged.


    Cooper's Path to Student Leadership

    [05:00-15:00]

    Cooper walked through his journey from Alabama transfer to student government leader, explaining how communication (or lack thereof) was often the biggest challenge in student government. His presidency was notably successful with unusually good cooperation between the executive and congressional branches.


    How the Bison Movement Started

    [15:00-25:00]

    The perfect storm began in fall 2024 when IU football's incredible season created unprecedented campus unity. Cooper had a conversation with Athletics Director Scott Dolson about how football was bringing students together like nothing had in years. Learning that the original bison mascot came from student government action in the 1960s, Cooper decided to follow that historical playbook.


    Galen's Years-Long Campaign

    [25:00-35:00]

    Galen explained how multiple groups had been working toward this goal independently:

    • Homefield Apparel's bison merchandise starting around 2015-2016
    • Professor Paul Gutar's grassroots campaign with merchandise
    • Galen's "Bring Back the Bison" advocacy on Crimson Cast
    • Athletics department's growing interest

    All these efforts converged at exactly the right time.


    The Student Government Battle

    [35:00-45:00]

    What Cooper thought would be a quick, fun vote turned into a three-hour debate lasting until midnight. The main opposition centered around fears of bringing back the original 1960s costume, which everyone agreed was genuinely terrifying. Cooper's brilliant move: posting an Instagram poll during the meeting that got 750+ responses in three minutes, with 70-80% student support.


    Making the Case for Skeptics

    [45:00-55:00]

    Galen laid out the three-part argument for the bison:

    • Historical connection to Indiana (bison territory, Buffalo Trace, state seal)
    • Gives the "Hoosier" name a visual identity it's always lacked
    • Commercial necessity - most successful college programs have mascots

    The Bigger Picture

    [55:00-End]

    Cooper shared how Alabama integrated their mascot into the entire university experience, not just sports.

    The group discussed how the bison could serve multiple generations - from young kids meeting the mascot to alumni having a consistent symbol to rally around. Galen reflected that if contributing to bringing back the bison is his main legacy at IU, he'd be satisfied with that impact.


    And much more …

    See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.
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    1 h y 4 m
  • [32] The Mid-Major Purge

    [32] The Mid-Major Purge
    Jun 1 2025
    Bob Moats and Mike Wiemuth examine how the transfer portal and NIL have fundamentally altered the landscape for mid-major teams and their ability to pull off NCAA tournament upsets.[0:00-5:00] Introduction & Producer WelcomeIntroduction of new producer William McDermottDiscussion of recent Indy 500 raceSetup for main topic on March Madness becoming "less mad"[5:00-15:00] The Old Formula for Mid-Major UpsetsAnalysis of Mercer's 2014 upset victory over Duke as the archetypal exampleTwo key historical advantages identified:Experience advantage: Mercer's starting five had 20 years combined college experience vs Duke's 10 yearsRoster continuity: Four of Mercer's starters played together since 2012 (90+ games as a unit) vs Duke's 14 games togetherHistorical pattern of upsets featuring experienced, cohesive mid-major teams against talent-heavy but inexperienced major programs[15:00-30:00] Transfer Portal's Devastating Impact on Mid-MajorsStark statistics: 80% of quality mid-major players (starters averaging 10+ PPG) now transfer upConference-by-conference breakdown:Southern Conference: Only 1 of 11 top returning players stayingMissouri Valley Conference: Just 3 of 15 top players returning (80% bleed rate)The "dual challenge": Mid-majors lose their best players while also losing potential replacements to major programs[30:00-40:00] The New Minor League RealityMid-majors now function as a development system for power conferencesPower conference coaches no longer need to gamble on unproven recruitsCan simply observe and poach players who prove themselves at lower levels[40:00-50:00] Alternative Models for Future Success"Ocean's Eleven" approach: Assembling rosters from multiple transfer sources (Indiana State 2024 example)Coach-led transfers: Bringing entire successful programs up levels (Ben McCollum at Drake example)Systematic advantages through coaching and scheme rather than talent accumulation[50:00-55:00] Looking Forward & Market AdaptationRecognition that upsets will become increasingly rareAlternative postseason opportunities like NIT may gain importanceCollege basketball still in flux with final competitive equilibrium yet to be establishedThe episode ultimately suggests that while the magic of March may be diminishing, mid-major programs that can adapt to this new reality may still find ways to compete—just not in the same David vs. Goliath fashion that made college basketball's greatest upsets so memorable.Resources:George Martin : https://youtu.be/h3AY1CVUgJw?si=JQRdg3o2zh7bQkzMDelta force theme Indy 500: https://youtu.be/CSzgwCql_mo?si=X8_eZQgvLUNhRwEDSam Posey: https://youtu.be/8I7gKuoEMCM?si=1sXoeRtSeZh0tfLgBoom Baby: https://youtu.be/xRXScx4gsYk?si=zJkZ17XDiwCKuwZtWonder Indiana: https://blog.library.in.gov/wander-indiana-let-your-wanderin-spirit-come-on-thru/Mercer: https://youtu.be/oNWe8kqBRlg?si=rd-Kj6oW_TncPaUPLehigh: https://youtu.be/06c1eOgZQeo?si=xuptNn-XPkR55hFZOceans 11: https://youtu.be/imm6OR605UI?si=lFwM-60fR4Glp8zMOriginal Oceans 11: https://youtu.be/ppVby97BNiw?si=xqTcDBbfNUbREbIbThe End (Beatles): https://youtu.be/12R4FzIhdoQ?si=HjosVjomRxmIgHqNHer Majesty (Beatles): https://youtu.be/12R4FzIhdoQ?si=EP5GhjVo9e0zeKEiMid Major Donor Article Insights from Top NIL Supporters at the Group of 5 LevelSeed RecordsRecords for every seed in March Madness from 1985 to 2025Mid Major Viability ArticleNo One Mourns the Mid-Majors: Can Mid-Major Schools Survive Under the House v. NCAA Settlement Agreement, or is College Athletics Destined to Downsize? — Kentucky Law JournalSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.
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    1 h y 36 m
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