In this episode of The Wholehearted Way, host Nathan King and co-host Mandi Wellington sit down with Pastor Bobbi Lassiter, Associate Pastor at Covenant Methodist Church, to explore the life-changing shift from performance to presence.

Bobbi shares her powerful personal journey of confronting the "secret lies" that many leaders carry—specifically the gut-level belief of "I’m not enough"—and how those lies create a cycle of exhaustion and isolation. As a reluctant leader who once feared she didn't have a "seat at the table," Bobby discusses how true productivity in any organization—whether a church or a corporation—actually skyrockets when people feel known, cared for, and free to be human.

In this episode, we discuss:

• The Productivity Paradox: Why slowing down to care for your soul (and your team's) actually leads to better long-term results.
• Confronting the "I'm Not Enough" Lie: How identifying childhood survival techniques can break the cycle of self-sabotage in adulthood.
• The Power of the Feelings Wheel: Moving from being "scared" of emotions to using them as a tool for freedom and connection.
• Leading with Vulnerability: Why leaders must go first in admitting flaws to build authentic, trustworthy communities.
• A Marathon, Not a Sprint: Understanding that true spiritual and emotional transformation takes time and "mustard-seed" faith.

Whether you are a high-stakes executive, a ministry leader, or someone simply tired of the "human doing" treadmill, Bobby’s story offers a roadmap out of isolation and into a life where your heart is truly aligned with the person God created you to be.

Resources Mentioned:

• Deepen your journey: Learn more about the Wholehearted Living Discipleship Program and Wellspring Group at Wellspring Group.
• The Book: Discover the framework behind these conversations in Becoming Wholehearted by Larry Bolden and Anisa Sumlar.

Join the Conversation: Subscribe for more honest talks on leadership, faith, and the path to a whole heart.

#TheWholeheartedWay #Leadership #BobbyLassiter #Vulnerability #SpiritualGrowth #HumanDoing #EmotionalHealth #FaithAtWork #BecomingWholehearted

Most workplaces are an emotional desert. We are taught to check our feelings at the door, put our heads down, and focus solely on the bottom line. But what if bringing your whole heart to work is actually the secret to unprecedented team loyalty, engagement, and success?

In this episode of The Wholehearted Way, we sit down with Matt Armbruster, a corporate leader who decided to test a radical theory. After experiencing profound personal connection and emotional renewal at a retreat, Matt bravely brought those same principles of vulnerability and deep listening into his secular, high-pressure corporate environment.

The results speak for themselves. While his industry faced massive resignation spikes and turnover during the COVID pandemic, Matt’s team experienced zero turnover. Leadership took notice, ultimately creating an entirely new role for him centered around employee engagement.

If you are a leader, manager, or anyone tired of the dry, dusty corporate grind, this conversation will give you the courage and the tools to bring real humanity back to your workplace.

In this episode, we cover:

• The Corporate Desert: Why the "leave your emotions at home" mentality is actively harming your team's culture and your bottom line.
• The Power of Being Heard: How Matt implemented authentic, active listening in a secular business setting, and the dramatic shift it caused.
• The 3-Point Response Framework: A simple, actionable method to honor your employees when they share something difficult.
• Connection Groups at Work: How to successfully pilot small peer-support groups in the workplace without crossing professional boundaries.
• The Fear of Emotion: How to overcome the apprehension of "opening Pandora's box" when engaging with your team's real feelings.

Resources & Links:

• Learn more about our mission and listen to more episodes: https://wholeheartedwaypodcast.com
• Discover more about the retreats and programs mentioned in this episode at Wellspring Group.

Subscribe & Review: If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe to The Wholehearted Way on your favorite podcast platform and leave us a review! Your support helps us bring more of these vital conversations to leaders everywhere.

"I hate it here."

It's a phrase clinical psychologist Dan Sartor heard from his own kids for years -- and it cut deep every time. Until he realized they weren't rejecting his home. They were expressing something they couldn't fix on their own: a longing for peace, connection, and presence that our hurried lives keep pushing to the margins.

Most of us know that feeling. We scroll past it, stay busy through it, or dream of relocating, hoping a change of scenery will resolve something that's actually happening inside us. But what if the answer isn't escaping? What if it's slowing down enough to let ourselves -- and the people around us -- be truly known?

In this episode of The Wholehearted Way, Nathan King and Mandi Wellington sit down with Dr. Dan Sartor, a clinical psychologist with over 30 years of experience in what he calls "soul care." Together, they explore why we struggle to connect at the level we were made for -- and what it looks like to start.

In this conversation, we explore:

• Soul Care vs. Surface Fixes: Why addressing anxiety, conflict, or addiction at the behavioral level often misses the deeper issue -- and what changes when we go to the level of the soul.
• Why We Can't Connect: How relational deficits from childhood, cultural pace, and technology create a "perfect storm" of soul atrophy -- even among people surrounded by others.
• The Therapy Paradox: Dan's striking observation that people opened up honestly in his counseling office but showed up in "Sunday best" at church -- and what that reveals about the communities we're building.
• "I Hate It Here": A father's journey from taking his kids' words personally to hearing the longing underneath -- and why God responds to our lament the same way.
• The Montana Metaphor: Why our desire to escape to somewhere slower and simpler points to a deeper hunger for the kingdom of God, which Dallas Willard said moves at about three miles per hour.
• God's Plan A: Why deep, vulnerable community isn't a nice-to-have for the church -- it's the very mechanism God designed for healing and transformation.
• The Dark Night of the Soul: How Jesus on the cross -- feeling forsaken by God himself -- gives us permission to bring our rawest, most honest selves into relationship with him and each other.

Whether you feel stuck in surface-level friendships, exhausted by performing your faith, or quietly wondering why "the formula" isn't working, this conversation offers a different way forward -- one that starts with being honest about where you actually are.

About Dan Sartor

Dr. Dan Sartor is a licensed clinical psychologist and professional counselor with over 30 years of experience. He serves as the director of outpatient counseling and spiritual retreats at the Wing Center in Flowery Branch, Georgia. In addition to his clinical work, Dan coaches nonprofit and ministry leaders, walking alongside them as they lead, serve, and sustain their impact. He has been married for 35 years and has four adult children and a granddaughter.

Resources Mentioned:

• New Book: Becoming Wholehearted by Larry Bolden and Anisa Sumlar (becomingwholehearted.org)
• Wellspring Group: wellspringgroup.org
• Listen to more: wholeheartedwaypodcast.com

"I do what I don't want to do."

It’s the ancient struggle Paul described in Romans 7, and it’s a reality many of us face every day. We rationally believe in God’s love and want to be present for our families, yet in moments of pressure, we react out of fear, control, or exhaustion—effectively sabotaging the very things we long for most.

In this episode of The Wholehearted Way, host Nathan King sits down with Wellspring Group founder Larry Bolden and Creative Director Anisa Sumlar to celebrate the launch of their new book, Becoming Wholehearted. Together, they pull back the curtain on the "internal disconnect" that keeps us stuck in cycles of self-sabotage.

In this conversation, we explore:

• False Visceral Beliefs: Why our "gut-level" beliefs (often formed in childhood) frequently override our intellectual or biblical truths.
• The Four Levels of the Heart: Moving beyond just "thinking" and "choosing" to engage the deeper realms of "feeling" and "desiring".
• The "Cats in the Cradle" Trap: Larry shares a poignant reflection on how even "good, Godly men" can unintentionally repeat the cycles of distance they once vowed to break.
• The Theology of Socks: Anisa tells a surprising story about a department store and a sock survey that revealed her own self-protective strategies against wanting beauty.
• From Black & White to Color: Moving from "knowing about" God to an experiential, "full-color" relationship with Him.

Whether you feel "burned out" on religious performance or simply wonder why you can't seem to follow through on your best intentions, this episode offers a signpost toward a life of greater integration and "ever becoming".

Resources Mentioned:

• The New Book: Becoming Wholehearted by Larry Bolden and Anisa Sumlar.
• Deepen the Journey: Download the free study guide and find more resources at becomingwholehearted.org.
• Listen to more: wholeheartedwaypodcast.com

Can you be "transparent" without actually being vulnerable? Many leaders and high-achievers use achievement, control, and even "helping" as protective strategies to keep people at a distance. In this episode, Nathan King and Mandy Wellington sit down with Larry Bolden, the founder of Wellspring Group, to discuss the difficult but transformative journey from living for achievement to living for intimacy.

Larry shares the pivotal moment in 2002 when he began to move beyond a rational, theological understanding of God’s love and into a wholehearted experience of it. He breaks down why true transformation cannot happen in isolation and why we often settle for "transparency behind a glass window" instead of the radical vulnerability required for real connection.

In this episode, you’ll discover:

• The Difference Between Helping and Connecting: How "helping" can actually be a way to avoid true intimacy.
• The Four Levels of the Heart: Why integrating your desires, feelings, thoughts, and choices is essential for wholeness.
• The "Glass Window" Effect: Why being open about the past isn't the same as being reachable in the present.
• A New Path for Leaders: Why pastors and leaders often feel isolated and how to build "wholehearted community".

About Larry Bolden

Larry Bolden founded Wellspring Group in 2003 after a 13-year career in financial consulting and 13 years serving as a pastor. He is the co-author of the new book, Becoming Wholehearted, which explores the path of humility and connection with God and others. Larry holds an MA in Counseling and has dedicated over two decades to guiding thousands through the "Battle for the Heart" retreat series.

Resources Mentioned:

• Wellspring Group: wellspringgroup.org
• New Book: Becoming Wholehearted by Larry Bolden and Anisa Sumler (becomingwholehearted.org)
• The Wholehearted Way Podcast: thewholeheartedway.transistor.fm

Have you ever noticed that you can be completely settled in your own life, yet totally blind to the walls you’ve built to stay safe? In this episode, Nathan King is joined by Mandi Wellington and Laura Arnold to explore a powerful paradox: sometimes the most profound growth doesn't come from a "5-step plan," but from simply hearing someone else have the courage to be vulnerable.

Mandi shares her recent realization, sparked by a previous conversation with Abby Mandella, that she had been avoiding "Door Number 2," a symbolic place of internal pain she wasn't ready to face. The group discusses how authentic community acts as a mirror, illuminating the blind spots we can't see on our own and moving us from a life of "performance for approval" to one of "sustained joy" and kindness.

In this episode, we discuss:

• The "Mirror Effect" of Community: Why listening to another person’s struggle can be more therapeutic than receiving direct advice.
• Opening "Door Number 2": Identifying the areas of pain or fear we've been avoiding and finding the courage to walk through them.
• From Duty to Delight: Shifting your relationship with God from one of "duty and obligation" to one of "gentle kindness."
• The Power of Remembrance: Using the biblical practice of recalling past faithfulness to fuel present courage.

Join us for a deep dive into what it means to live in a wholehearted community where being "raw and real" is the catalyst for true transformation.

The Wholehearted Way podcast is published by Wellspring Group. For more information about the upcoming "Becoming Wholehearted" book, please visit becomingwholehearted.org

Join us for this episode of The Wholehearted Way podcast, published by Wellspring Group, with a focus on how to live deeper, more fulfilling lives in wholehearted communities.

Our hosts, Nathan King and Mandi Wellington, spoke with Abby Mandella about Wellspring Group’s mission of spiritual formation and the upcoming release of their new book Becoming Wholehearted.

Mandela explains that the ministry focuses on helping individuals overcome the internal disconnect between their rational beliefs and emotional lives by fostering deeper connections with God, themselves, and others. She shares her personal transition from a guarded, introverted accountant to a vulnerable leader, emphasizing that true transformation occurs through the support of a wholehearted community. The conversation highlights how the new book and podcast aim to make these complex psychological and biblical concepts more accessible to the public. Ultimately, the source serves as an invitation for listeners to move away from self-protection and toward a life of authentic obedience and relational wholeness.

For more information about the upcoming Becoming Wholehearted book, please visit becomingwholehearted.org

Join us for this episode of The Wholehearted Way podcast, published by Wellspring Group, with a focus on how to live deeper, more fulfilling lives in wholehearted communities.

Our host, Nathan King, spoke with Laura Arnold about how she has stepped away from hiding her identity, and now shows others her fierce, wholehearted identity in Christ. She’s become a woman who weeps when God weeps, who fights for others’ freedom, and who creates spaces for others to encounter Jesus in powerful, personal ways.

From discipling young families to boldly calling women into deeper intimacy with God, Laura lives what she teaches: that each of us carries a God-given essence the world needs. Her life is an invitation to authenticity, surrender, and Spirit-led leadership.

For more information about the upcoming "Becoming Wholehearted" book, please visit becomingwholehearted.org