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In this episode, Sharon Miller sits down with Glenn Packiam and worship pastors Luke and Anna Hellebronth to explore the relationship between senior pastors and worship leaders and why it matters for a healthy church. Drawing from their experience at Rockharbor Church, they discuss how trust, alignment, and shared vision shape both services and culture. They offer practical insight into planning, navigating creative tension, and partnering in leadership. This conversation equips pastors to build stronger, more aligned relationships with their worship leaders.

• Download Parenting the Open Generation at worldvision.org/resilient26.
• Watch this episode on Barna’s YouTube Channel.
• View all Resilient Pastor podcast episodes on our podcast page.

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In this episode, Glenn Packiam sits down with pastor and author Jay Kim to explore how church leaders can navigate technology and AI with wisdom and clarity. Drawing on ministry experience in Silicon Valley, Jay reflects on how digital tools can serve as a “front door” for connection while still pointing people toward embodied spiritual formation and community. Together they discuss how pastors can embrace innovation without losing the irreplaceable power of human presence in ministry.

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• Download Barna’s newest report, developed in partnership with Pushpay, Technology for Missional Impact, to explore how churches are using digital tools and AI to support ministry and mission. Download the report here.
• Download Parenting the Open Generation at worldvision.org/resilient26.
• Watch this episode on Barna’s YouTube Channel.

View all Resilient Pastor podcast episodes on our podcast page.

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In this episode, Glenn Packiam, Rich Villodas and Sharon Hodde Miller explore what it looks like to lead well with your board of elders. Drawing from personal experience and Barna insights, they discuss alignment, shared authority, healthy accountability and the spiritual rhythms that shape strong pastor–elder relationships. Whether you’re planting a church or strengthening an existing leadership team, this conversation offers practical wisdom for cultivating trust, clarity and resilience in church leadership.

• For more related insights on church leadership and governance, download your copy of Barna's The State of Pastors Volume 2 report.
• Download Parenting the Open Generation at worldvision.org/resilient26.
• Watch this episode on Barna’s YouTube Channel.
• View all Resilient Pastor podcast episodes on our podcast page