Nick Cohen talks to leading US political commentator Charlie Sykes about the impact of Donald Trump's presidency on American politics and conservative institutions, with Charlie sharing his perspective as one of the first "Never Trump" conservatives and discussing the erosion of traditional conservative values and principles. They examine how Trump's rise was connected to broader trends in right-wing politics, including the appeal to "own the libs" and the normalisation of previously unacceptable behaviour. They discuss their concerns about Trump's potential future political influence and the need for institutions, media, and individuals to push back against extreme political trends in both the US and U.K.

Conservatives voices must take on Trump & the radical right

Charlie says his fellow "Never Trump" Conservatives made a huge strategic error in confronting Trump and MAGA before the 2024 presidential election, saying, "I think it was a major mistake for much of the Never Trump movement to basically become Liberal Democrats. Because what happened is they were no longer speaking to those centre Right. Conservative swing voters. They were perceived to be simply just parroting the other lines. And by the way, take some responsibility. I'm a contributor for the Progressive network, MSNBC, and I think this is a real problem.

"The other problem was that during the Biden years, I think that one of the, the fundamental roles of the centre. You know, the centre should have been to keep the administration from, from going too far left on all of the issues on crime, on immigration, on the trans issue. And by the way, Democrats are still deeply in denial."

You have to stop Farage now - before it's too late

Charlie Sykes warns the UK that Nigel Farage and Reform have to be stopped now before it is too late. Ciservative vocies must play their part in preventing the UK sinking into a Trump-like darknes, adding, " If in late 2015 if you had big conservative voices like Rush Limbaugh, not a fan, but if Rush Limbaugh would've told his audience, come on, people. Donald Trump's a joke. Donald Trump is not what we have fought for all these years. the best time to get these to stop these guys is on the launchpad before they achieve velocity.

"Maybe too late. but it's gotta be done early and it's gotta be done forceful because it's if you, if if you, if you don't do it now, it's gonna be exponentially harder a year from now. "

Charlie Sykes @SykesCharlie is a leading highly respected United States conservative political commentator who was formerly editor-in-chief and founder of the highly influential website The Bulwark. Charlie has been a leading Never Trump Conservative since Trump stood for the presidency in 2015. Charlie's Substack - To the contrary is a must read, and his regular podcast - also called To the contrary - a must listen. He has also been a columnist and author for the progressive channel MSNBC.

Nick Cohen's @NichCohen4 latest Substack column Writing from London on politics and culture from the UK and beyond.

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Nick Cohen talks to Ed Hodgson from the More in Common think-tank about growing concerns over the potential shift towards extreme right-wing politics by Nigel Reform & his latest insurgent party Reform and the implications for British society and the political landscape. Ed Hodgson explores divisions in British society and the rise of the Reform, while examining public sentiment towards immigration policies and the challenges facing Labour under Keir Starmer's leadership. The conversation concluded with an analysis of the current political dynamics, including the complexities of the British electoral system and the challenges of polling and predicting future elections.

Farage's Right-Wing Political Shift

Nick and Ed discuss Reform's potential shift towards extreme right-wing politics, citing Farage's recent proposals to abolish indefinite leave to remain and his embrace of pseudoscientific claims. He argues that Farage's rhetoric is being influenced by Trump and that the British media and political class have not adequately recognised this shift. Ed and Nick discuss ways in which mainstream parties can counter the toxic messaging from the extreme right and & its apparently unstoppable rise. these divisions in British society and the need to address extremism.

Farage Trump worship could backfire

Ed says Farage's craven worship of Donald Trump and his copying out of the worst of MAGA excesses - particularly on prurient and untrue allegations again migrants - could backfire among Brits who increasingly see the US as a hositle power, adding, "...people who say America is an ally in Britain has fallen to less than half. Right. In America, More than 80% of Americans think that Britain is an ally. So there's this weird sort of one way relationship going on, at least in a public opinion perspective, where Americans still feel very close to Britain and Britain's in many way do feel quite close to America."

More in Common is a think-tank that seeks to understand polarisation and to work on initiatives to tackle division in our society. The innovative and extensive research we have carried out in the UK forms the basis of our efforts to tackle division.

Ed Hodgson @edhodgsoned is deputy director for More in Common in 2022 @Moreincommon. Ed manages More in Common UK's polling function on a day-to-day basis, and has led More in Common's in-depth research into topics such as assisted dying, Progressive Activists, the Israel-Gaza war, and tackling climate change.

Nick Cohen's @NichCohen4 latest Substack column Writing from London on politics and culture from the UK and beyond.

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Let's face it - Labour inherited a total shit show after 14 years of Tory misrule - an economy crippled by Brexit, immigration chaos, turds in our rivers and seas, and rapidly deteriorating public services. But - inevitably - it's Sir Keir Starmer who's getting the blame for the country's woes, thanks mainly to the the fickleness of the electorate as well as the country's evident decline. But Labour seems to have bent over backwards to help its opponents with self-inflicted wounds such as inept communications, avoidable scandal and bouts of epic political bungling.

As the Labour Party Conference gets under way next weekend, Nick Cohen talks to Keir Starmer's biographer Tom Baldwin about the prime minister's leadership position within the Labour Party, examining the PM's challenges and potential future in politics.

Labour needs to expose the malice and plastic patriotism of the Far Right

Nick and Tom discuss the current state of Labour's position, focusing on whether Sir Keir Starmer's leadership is in jeopardy. They highlighted Labour's low vote share in the 2024 election and recent poor opinion poll ratings, including a recent approval rating of minus 54 for Keir Starmer. The discussion touches on the potential leadership challengers within the Labour Party, including, possibly the current metro-mayor for Greater Manchester, Andy Burnham, with Nick noting the historic difficulty of replacing a sitting Prime Minister, particularly in the Labour Party. In contrast, as we know, the Tories have never had any problem knifing their leaders in the back - or front.

Both Tom and Nick explore the broader topic of combating the far right in politics. Tom says Starmer should articulate Labour values more forcefully and espouse his own more gentle and inclusive version of patriotism in stark contrast to the nationalist bombast of Nigel Farage and and the more sinister extremism of Tommy Robinson/Yaxley-Lennon.

Starmer needs to articulate & lead national renewal

Tom says Starmer needs to be able to convincingly argue for a gentle and inclusive patriotism, to lead a sense of national renewal and take on the plastic patriots of Farage and the far right, He says, "It's not some sepia-tinted restoration of the past. It's not some like we're going to like back ruling the waves like Boris Johnson pretended, or you where the country invented liberties. So we don't need to be members of the ECHR or this nonsense."

The paperback version of Tom's must-read bestseller, Keir Starmer, the biography, is out now with updated chapters.

Nick Cohen's @NichCohen4 latest Substack column Writing from London on politics and culture from the UK and beyond.

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Nick Cohen and Anne Applebaum discuss the current state of democracy in the United States and Europe, focusing on the rise of populism and identity politics, while exploring how political figures maintain support despite policy failures. They examined the systematic dismantling of American institutions under Trump's administration, including attacks on the civil service and potential weakening of military capabilities, while also discussing the emerging alliance between authoritarian states opposed to American influence. The conversation concluded with a discussion of the current state of American politics, including the narrow margins in recent elections and the need for effective opposition strategies to defend democratic values both in the U.S. and across Europe.

Democracy's Challenges in Populist Era

Anne and Nick talk about the current state of democracy in the United States and Europe, focusing on the rise of populism and the shift towards identity politics. Anne highlighted how political figures like Nigel Farage in the UK and Donald Trump in the US have maintained support despite policy failures, attributing it to the emotional appeal of their cultural identities. They explored the question of whether real-world issues like inflation and healthcare are now less important than online cultural battles. Andrew asked Anne about the dangers facing American democracy, to which she responded that it is indeed in danger, but the outcome is still uncertain.

The UK must wake up to the MAGA reality!

Anne argues that the UK should wake up to the new reality - Powerful elements at the top of the Trump White House & MAGA not only consider the so-called "special relationship" as not only over but see the UK as an enemy. Anne says, there's a very powerful strain. Inside this administration and inside the American far right who really hate Britain. And they hate Europeans and they hate the Germans. ... there's a constant narrative about how the British violate free speech and how, you know, Britain is, an extreme left country and so on."

She says, " I'm not saying they dominate this administration, and you won't hear this from Marco Rubio, but there is a strain inside MAGA, which essentially reflects Russian propaganda. ... there's a piece of, of that movement that doesn't really want anything to do with Britain or Europe anymore....I would watch out for that and as I said, have a contingency plan and think about a world in which the United States is run by people who are hostile to Britain."

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Nick Cohen and Sunder Katwala engage in a detailed discussion about the rise of right-wing extremism in Britain, analysing rabid right rabble-rousers like Nigel Farage and examining how his evolving stance and ambiguous approach appeal to both mainstream voters and extreme elements. They explored the current political climate, focusing on the challenges faced by mainstream conservative parties and the need for addressing legitimate concerns about immigration while drawing clear boundaries against racist ideologies. The conversation concluded with discussions about the fragmented state of British politics, the need for a coherent centre-right party, and the challenges faced by political leaders in navigating complex social and cultural issues.

Nick & Sunder discuss the rise of right-wing extremism in Britain, comparing current political figures like Nigel Farage to historical fascists. Sunder expresses concern about the right setting the agenda and the dominance of emotional arguments over factual evidence. However, he remained optimistic about the long-term progress of British society, drawing on his personal experiences of racial and cultural diversity.

Sunder says "we are under policing absolute fascism and racism. Elon Musk has brought it in and what [Steve] Bannon and Trump did is they said there will be no boundary between the respectful right and the racist."

Sunder says the sinister issue of so-called "re-migration" - in other words expelling ethnic minority Brits - will eventually do for the rabid right, saying, "There's immigration there's asylum. And these are tough issues in the centre left, but remotion, which is, you know, more people should leave them come in and re migration is a far right code ultimately for the people who really want to hear the word Remi.

It's about, you know, Sunder Katwala shouldn't been allowed to be born here. So if he was, let's get him out.... Okay. It's not gonna happen. But about from kick out the ethnic minority."

Hope can still beat hate

For all its problems, and the ranting of the right, Sunder argues the UK still has a lot going for it as a tolerant and diverse society, saying ":Britain is the most Successful multi-ethnic democracy in the western world. It's a generation ahead of Western Europe."

Overall, Sunder has a message of hope after a summer of far right race-baiting, demagoguery and even predictions of civil war: "It was a very sinister, silly season. We had people predicting civil war every weekend and it never quite erupting; Farage setting the asylum debate.

"It's felt like it's going backwards for a couple of years. We can and will reverse that...And you know, if people are making impossible promises to give us sort of fantasy politics that if you quit three more international treaties, your lives will be better. Let's make the opposite case."

Read all about it!

Sunder Katwala @sundersays is a director of the British Future think tank and a former general secretary of the Fabian Society. His book, How to be a patriot, is published by HarperNorth

Nick Cohen's @NichCohen4 latest Substack column Writing from London on politics and culture from the UK and beyond.

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Goodbye Normal - it was nice knowing you!

Nick Cohen and author & academic Yascha Mounk explore the enduring presence of populism and the challenges faced by centrists in adapting to changing political realities, discussing how assumptions about the world have evolved over the past 25 years. They examine various economic and political challenges across different countries, including Britain, Poland, and the United States, while analyzing how populists like Modi and Trump have capitalised on claims of representing the people against elites. The conversation concluded with discussions about the challenges facing American progressives and centre-left parties, emphasising the need for strategic adjustments and effective messaging to counteract populist threats and regain political credibility.

Challenges of Centrism in Populism Era

Yascha explains the enduring presence of populism and the challenges faced by centrists in the current political landscape. Yascha highlighted how assumptions about the world, particularly those held by liberal democrats, have been swept away over the past 25 years, similar to the period after World War II. He emphasises that centrists are often out of tune with the present because they cling to outdated worldviews rather than adapting to new realities. Andrew agreed, noting that Peter Mandelson's comment about Trump being the most consequential president in living memory reflects the shift from a neoliberal to a populist order.

Defending democracy and academic freedom

Yascha also emphasises the importance of defending democratic institutions and academic freedom against threats like Donald Trump, arguing that while some may have been willing to compromise on issues like diversity statements in the past, it is now crucial to stand firm. He criticises the tendency of some liberal professors and journalists to impose their values on society, which can backfire and drive people towards Trump-like figures.

Read all about it!

Yascha is Founder and Editor-in-Chief of the Persuasion Substack - @JoinPersuasion - and also has his own Yascha Mounk Substack column. A man of many talents, Yascha hosts his own podcast, The Good Fight. Yascha's latest and highly acclaimed book - The Identity Trap: A Story of Ideas and Power in Our Time - is published by Penguin. A political scientist, Yascha is also Professor of Practice at the School of Advanced International Studies of John Hopkins University in the U.S.

Nick Cohen's @NichCohen4 latest Substack column Writing from London on politics and culture from the UK and beyond.

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In this discussion, Nick Cohen and former diplomat Arthur Snell explore the complex relationship between Donald Trump and Russia, examining evidence suggesting Trump may be serving Russian interests either knowingly or unwittingly. They analyze Christopher Steele's controversial intelligence work on Trump-Russia connections, noting that despite criticism, many of his key allegations have proven accurate according to subsequent investigations, including the Senate Intelligence Committee report. The conversation concludes by addressing concerns about Trump's deferential behaviour toward Putin, his appointment of pro-Russian officials to intelligence positions, and the implications for US-UK intelligence sharing should Trump return to power.

In this discussion, Nick Cohen and former diplomat Arthur Snell explore the complex relationship between Donald Trump and Russia, examining evidence suggesting Trump may be serving Russian interests either knowingly or unwittingly. They analyse Christopher Steele's controversial intelligence work on Trump-Russia connections, noting that despite criticism, many of his key allegations have proven accurate according to subsequent investigations, including the Senate Intelligence Committee report. The conversation concludes by addressing concerns about Trump's deferential behaviour toward Putin, his appointment of pro-Russian officials to intelligence positions, and the implications for US-UK intelligence sharing should Trump return to power.

Trump's Russian Connection Examination

Nick Cohen introduces a discussion on whether Donald Trump is a Russian asset, with guest Arthur Snell, a former Foreign Office diplomat. Arthur explains there's a spectrum of possibilities, from Trump being a recruited KGB/FSB asset to him being an unwitting "agent of influence" serving Russian interests. They note Trump's unusual connections to the Soviet bloc during the Cold War, including his 1987 Moscow visit and marriage to Ivana from Czechoslovakia, emphasising how rare it was for American businessmen to engage with communist countries at that time.

.Arthur Snell's substack column is Not all doom & his regular inciteful podcast is Behind the Lines. Arthur's first not fiction book is How Britain Broke the World: War, Greed and Blunders from Kosovo to Afghanistan, 1997-2022 .

Nick Cohen's @NickCohen4 latest Substack column Writing from London on politics and culture from the UK and beyond. Read Nick's latest column, Can Europe resist Trump's gangsterism? Does it have the willpower to try?

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Nick Cohen talks to author and journalist James Bloodworth about the evolving nature of politics and media in today's digital age. James explores how traditional media institutions are losing influence while online platforms and personalities mainly of the radical and far right have become more prominent, particularly noting how successful figures leverage algorithms and controversial content to gain attention.

The strange death of the mainstream media

James Bloodworth discusses the changing media landscape, noting that traditional media outlets like newspapers and TV networks are losing relevance, especially among younger audiences. He observes that podcasts and social media have become more influential, with figures like Joe Rogan and Andrew Tate gaining significant followings. Bloodworth explains that successful online personalities often understand algorithms and use outrageous statements to gain attention, both from supporters and critics.

Victimhood is pay-dirt for online Radicalised Right

James Bloodworth says radical right figures are earning online fortunes with simple messaging, saying "You slowly learn that the nuanced articles don't get as many clicks and subscriptions, and people sending you money as the more inflammatory articles." He described figures such as Matthew Goodwin as "very obviously leaning into the white supremo types who give him money on his Substack." He adds, "I don't know how much of this stuff he actually believes, but he's willing to surf that wave because it because it seems to be making him quite a lot of money."

Online far right wingers are guilty of bad faith & hypocrisy

James says right wing charlatans are always banging on about free speech when it came to people jailed for inciting violence against immigrants like the wife of a Tory councillor, Lucy Connolly, while demanding the banning of pro-Palestinian protests. James adds, "I know there are people at those protests who have said anti-semitic things, and that there have been anti-semitic chants. But... there's a complete double standard. I think it's all bad faith, and I think the accusations, particularly against Keir Starmer of two-tiered justice, are completely absurd, considering he was involved in the prosecution of people following the 2011 riots."

Read all about it!

James Bloodworth, @J_Bloodworth, the author of The Lost Boys, A personal journey through the Manosphere published on June 5th by Atlantic Books. James's Sustack is For the Desk Drawer.

Nick Cohen's regular Substack column Writing from London on politics and culture from the UK and beyond is another must-read.

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