In this episode of Innovation Meets Leadership, host Natalie Born sits down with Clifton Dickens, a seasoned information security leader with over 30 years of experience spanning cybersecurity, IT audit, governance, and organizational leadership. This conversation goes beyond technology to explore how leadership mindset, diversity of thought, and healthy conflict directly impact innovation, decision-making, and long-term organizational resilience.Clifton challenges leaders to rethink how teams are built, how processes are designed, and why discomfort is often a signal—not a threat. From recognizing fragile leadership structures to reframing governance and security as strategic advantages, this episode offers practical wisdom for leaders who want stronger teams, smarter systems, and outcomes that actually work for everyone they serve.[00:00 – 03:30] Introducing Clifton Dickens & the Evolution of LeadershipClifton’s 30+ years in information security and IT leadership.Why leadership today must account for changing workforce expectations.Passion, flexibility, and purpose as drivers of modern work.[03:31 – 07:00] Vision, Creativity, and Thinking Beyond the BoxWhy innovation starts with the ability to imagine what doesn’t exist yet.The importance of childlike curiosity and asking “why.”How overconfidence and “knowing it all” can stall innovation.[07:01 – 10:30] Identifying Fragile Leadership and Team StructuresEarly warning signs of weak culture and vulnerable leadership systems.Why groupthink is one of the biggest risks inside organizations.The role of leaders in inviting honest input—not silent agreement.[10:31 – 14:30] The Power of Healthy ConflictWhy the best solutions come from differences of opinion.Reframing conflict as constructive friction rather than negativity.How avoiding conflict leads to products and systems that fail in the real world.[14:31 – 17:30] Governance, Compliance, and Security as Strategic AdvantagesWhy leaders often react emotionally to words like governance and compliance.How security and controls accelerate performance when framed correctly.Protecting critical data as both risk management and competitive advantage.[17:31 – 21:30] Process, Accountability, and Organizational ControlWhy leaders must understand where effort, labor, and energy are going.How documented processes create clarity and accountability.Clifton’s approach to periodically re-engineering team processes.[21:31 – 24:30] Diversity of Thought Drives Better OutcomesWhy homogeneous teams create solutions for only a small percentage of users.The danger of designing for comfort instead of effectiveness.How inclusive teams create products and systems that work for everyone.[24:31 – 28:00] Final Leadership TakeawaysWhy leaders must look at the organization from the top down.Understanding contribution, control, and direction.Where to connect with Clifton and continue the conversation.Quotes“If everyone thinks the same way, that’s a sign something is wrong.” – Clifton Dickens“The best solutions usually come out of some sort of conflict.” – Clifton Dickens“Innovation starts with asking ‘what if, even when the answer makes you uncomfortable.” – Clifton DickensConnect with Clifton DickensLinkedIn: Clifton Dickens https://www.linkedin.com/in/cliftondickens/If this conversation resonated with you, leave a review and share this episode with a leader who’s ready to build stronger teams, embrace diverse perspectives, and rethink how systems actually work.🎙️ And don’t forget to check out Natalie Born’s book, Set It on Fire: The Art of Innovation, available now at setitonfire.co—a powerful guide for leaders who want to transform how innovation really happens.Visit innovationmeetsleadership.com and connect with us on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, X, and YouTube.Don’t just get out of the box—break the box and set it on fire.🔥 Let’s go transform something!

In this episode of Innovation Meets Leadership, host Natalie Born sits down with executive coach, former diplomat, and author Rene Sonneveld for a powerful conversation about leadership, innovation, and the unseen forces that shape both.Rene explores why innovation doesn’t begin with strategy decks or brainstorm sessions—but with the courage to name what everyone feels and no one is saying. From family enterprises to executive teams, he explains how unspoken fears, emotional blind spots, and “elephants in the room” quietly block creativity and decision-making. This episode is a must-listen for leaders navigating complexity, legacy, and high-stakes conversations—at work and at home.

[00:00 – 02:30] Innovation Begins Where Certainty EndsWhy innovation often emerges from confusion, fear, and discomfort—not clarity.Rene’s global experience working with leaders and enterprise families.The link between emotional honesty and transformational leadership.

[02:31 – 05:50] The Elephant in the Family RoomWhat leaders lose when they avoid naming the real issue.How trapped energy and unspoken tension collapse creativity.Why this dynamic shows up in families, boards, and executive teams alike.

[05:51 – 09:40] Leaders Don’t Have Decision Problems—They Have Emotion-Naming ProblemsHow fear hijacks the nervous system and shuts down innovation.Fight, flight, or freeze responses in leadership settings.Why regulation—not fearlessness—creates better decisions.

[09:41 – 13:30] “Flipping the Lid” and the Amygdala HijackHow psychological threats trigger reactive leadership behavior.Why leaders say “the wrong thing” under pressure.The importance of pausing, breathing, and naming emotions to restore clarity.

[13:31 – 16:40] Naming Fear as the Gateway to BreakthroughWhy innovation cannot thrive in environments of fear or walking on eggshells.How truth-telling frees energy and reactivates creativity.A real-world example of long-stuck family dynamics unlocking new possibilities.

[16:41 – 19:20] Authenticity, Messiness, and Modern LeadershipWhy authenticity is becoming increasingly rare.The cost of performative leadership—especially in the age of social media.Why innovation flourishes when leaders allow complexity and humanity.

[19:21 – 22:50] Stories, Identity, and the Lids We Put on OurselvesHow internal narratives limit leadership capacity.Why the lies we believe quietly cap innovation.Reframing leadership as presence, not perfection.

[22:51 – 25:10] Ecosystems That Support InnovationWhy environment matters—at work and at home.The connection between place, pace, and creative capacity.Designing a life and leadership context that allows innovation to breathe.

[25:11 – 27:40] Final Reflections: Innovation as a PracticeWhy innovation is not a performance—but a daily practice.Rene’s parting message on courage, imagination, and trust.How naming truth transforms fear into possibility.

Quotes

“Innovation doesn’t start with what we put on paper. It starts with naming the things we are most afraid to say.” – Rene Sonneveld“Most leaders don’t have decision-making problems—they have emotion-naming problems.” – Rene Sonneveld“Naming isn’t confrontation. Naming is liberation.” – Rene Sonneveld

Guest Links

Website: https://www.renesonneveld.com/Book: The Elephant in the Family Room – Managing the Complexities of Legacy Business

If this conversation sparked something in you, trust that spark—because innovation starts there.

Leave a review and share this episode with a leader who needs the courage to name what’s been left unsaid.

And don’t forget to check out Natalie Born’s book, Set It on Fire: The Art of Innovation, available now at setitonfire.co—a powerful guide for leaders ready to break patterns and transform how innovation actually happens.

Visit innovationmeetsleadership.com and connect with us on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, X, and YouTube.Don’t just get out of the box—break the box and set it on fire.Let’s go transform something! 🔥