Episodios

  • Settlers of Catan: B2B Marketing Lessons on Thinking Beyond Your Next Move with Chief Marketing Officer at Dialpad, Jen Grant

    Settlers of Catan: B2B Marketing Lessons on Thinking Beyond Your Next Move with Chief Marketing Officer at Dialpad, Jen Grant
    Apr 29 2025
    Marketing isn’t just about tactics, it’s about strategy. And most times, the smartest move is playing the long game.That’s the strategy behind Settlers of Catan, a board game built on resource trading, calculated risks, and thinking three steps ahead. In this episode, we’re drawing inspiration from its gameplay with our special guest, Jen Grant, Chief Marketing Officer at Dialpad.Together, we explore what B2B marketers can learn from staying focused on their own path, anticipating competitor reactions, and building a diversified strategy that drives long-term growth. Because in both Settlers of Catan and marketing, the real power play is thinking beyond your next move.About our guest, Jen GrantBefore joining Dialpad as Chief Marketing Officer in October 2024, Jen served on the Dialpad Board of Directors, held C-level positions at Cube and Appify, led Looker’s marketing, drove the rebrand of Elastic, and grew Box to an industry-leading enterprise content company. Jen holds an MBA from Wharton, a BA from Princeton, and has been recognized as one of the Top 100 Princeton Technology leaders.What B2B Companies Can Learn From Settlers of Catan:Play your own game. In Catan, constantly reacting to what others are doing can leave you scrambling. The same applies in B2B marketing. Jen encourages a more grounded approach: “You do much better, sort of very quietly focusing on your own growth.” Instead of chasing competitors or mimicking market leaders, build a strategy that aligns with your own long-term vision. Because sustainable growth isn’t won through noise, but through quiet, deliberate moves.Always be forecasting. Winning at Catan means thinking ahead, not just about your next move, but the ones after that. Jen says,  “I actually really love the strategy part of it. Thinking about, okay, we're about to launch a particular feature. What's that gonna make the competition do?” In a competitive landscape, it’s not enough to plan for what you control; you also need to anticipate how others will react. Great marketers operate like strategic game players. Don’t bet on just one road to victory. Catan punishes one-dimensional players. You can’t win by hoarding sheep alone, you need balance. Jen explains, “It is never one thing…It's all of the things at the same time, executed perfectly well.” Diversification isn’t just about spreading risk; it’s about orchestrating a full-spectrum effort that compounds over time. The most impactful marketing isn’t siloed, it’s symphonic.Quotes*“The thing about Catan, and other board games, this might come into play too, but you could potentially spend all of your time trying to crush the other players…And when you play a game a lot, you're like, oh, I'm gonna try this strategy this time, see what happens. And one of the things that I've definitely never seen work is if you focus all your energy on messing with other people. You do much better sort of very quietly, focusing on your own growth.”*“ I actually think the reason I like the game so much is the game theory of thinking ahead, 2, 3, 4 steps ahead. And so you're thinking how am I gonna achieve my goals, but what are they gonna do when I do, whatever it is, buy this road. I love that part of the game. I love thinking out ahead, okay, if we do this, then what are they gonna do? And for marketing, I think we often get caught up in the fun, creative part of marketing. But I actually really love the strategy part of it, of thinking about, okay, we're about to launch a particular feature. What's that gonna make the competition do? Are they gonna freak out? Are we kind of catching up to them? And maybe we shouldn't be so loud about it 'cause we should have had this before. All of the different implications of what you do in a market and then how the competition actually responds.”*“ So the thing about Catan at the very beginning of the game is that there are numbers on every square. And so you get to choose two places to put your little settlement, and there are three numbers for each of those settlements. So right there, you have six numbers, and the numbers are on resources. And what's really important, and many people don't think about this, is you wanna have all of the resources available to you on numbers that get rolled frequently, but you can't be on only two numbers. And it kind of speaks to diversifying tactics. So that to me goes right to marketing. Oftentimes, we'll get CEOs or CFOs, probably more likely. Just find that one thing that works really well and put all your budget into the one thing, and you're like, it is never one thing. Never, never, never is it one thing. It's all of the things at the same time executed perfectly well.”Time Stamps[0:55] Meet Jen Grant, Chief Marketing Officer at Dialpad[02:10] Why Settlers of Catan[03:08] The Role of CMO at Dialpad[04:52] Dialpad's Evolution[09:19] Dialpad's Super Bowl Ad[10:40] Origins of Settlers of Catan[16:23...
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    58 m
  • 90s Indie Rock: B2B Marketing Lessons on Cutting Through the Noise with Chief Marketing Officer at DataArt, Scott Rayburn

    90s Indie Rock: B2B Marketing Lessons on Cutting Through the Noise with Chief Marketing Officer at DataArt, Scott Rayburn
    Apr 22 2025
    Polished is out. Grit is in. If you want your brand to cut through the noise, it might be time to take a cue from the underground music scene.In this episode, we’re taking lessons from 90s indie rock with special guest Scott Rayburn, CMO of DataArt. Together, we talk about how brands can market with meaning, stay relevant in the digital age, and create content that hits like your favorite song.About our guest, Scott RayburnScott Rayburn is the Chief Marketing Officer at DataArt. He’s experienced in leading cross-functional, high-performing content, GTM/sales, comms, operations, and creative teams, and skilled in content strategy, sales enablement, demand generation, SEO, product marketing, website strategy, branding, partner marketing, and providing creative direction.Scott has been with DataArt since 2023. Prior to his current role, he served as Director of GTM & Content at global technology services company Wizeline. He has also led product marketing at companies like The Risk Management Association and Proscia.What B2B Companies Can Learn From 90s Indie Rock:Lead with authenticity.
Great marketing doesn’t have to be glossy, it just has to be real. The best indie rock bands of the '90s didn’t rely on flashy production or major label backing to build loyal followings. They embraced raw sound, DIY, and intimate venues, and that resonated deeply with fans. Scott draws a parallel to modern marketing: “People can see through BS… you actually generally will get better results from the kind of authentic stuff.”Think in lifetimes, not just campaigns.
The strongest brands create lasting emotional connections, much like your favorite bands. “These bands that started in the eighties are still filling up 5,000-person theaters today,” Scott explains. Why? Because their fans feel a deep, emotional connection. For marketers, this means nurturing your audience beyond the funnel. Build a brand people want to grow old with, not just click on once.Stay active on every channel.
Indie rock bands don’t just put out an album and disappear. Scott says, “Even if they're not making new songs, they need these channels to stay relevant, to sell tickets, to sell merch. It's all kinds of tied to marketing. And this is a tie between the authenticity and customer lifetime value. It's really activating that in a digital age.” Marketers need to do the same. A strong multi-channel strategy ensures your message reaches people where they are, whether that’s a blog, a webinar, an event, or a TikTok feed. Being present across platforms consistently helps brands stay top of mind, accessible, and adaptable to change.Quotes*“ This authenticity that we were talking about with these bands, people can see through BS. Whether it's like an Instagram reel or a LinkedIn ad, or an email campaign. It can still work. Your marketing can still work if it's completely polished. But I think, and I see from some results that come from a company work that DataArt is doing. You actually generally will get better results from the kind of authentic stuff. And this is kind of where you see brand maybe driving more revenue than demand generation, but who can actually count the dollars from brand? Well, not me, but maybe someone can let me know. So those conversations are happening.”*“ These bands that started in the eighties are still filling up 5,000-person theaters today… There's this multi-channel approach, which is a huge part of marketing and content marketing. You notice they're all on Spotify. They all have websites, they all have social media. Even if they're not making new songs, they need these channels to stay relevant, to sell tickets, to sell merch, e-commerce. It's all kind of tied to marketing. And this is a tie between the authenticity and customer lifetime value. It's really activating that in a digital age.*“ The number one thing I've noticed in content marketing is the huge need to transition from the faceless 1000-word blog post to something that's more interactive. The quote with somebody's face on your social media post is gonna perform five times better than the faceless five AI trends.”*“ You can't do everything yourself. Build a good team around you. Be T-shaped 'cause you're not gonna be a marketing leader if you're not T-shaped…And try to create some way that you can stay focused on your strengths, and then lean on others who have strengths of their own. Have this kind of holistically built type of leadership team.”Time Stamps[0:55] Scott Rayburn, CMO at DataArt[02:02] Why 90s Indie Rock?[03:53] What is Record Store Day?[04:55] The Role of CMO at Data Art[06:38] Origins of 90s Indie Rock[10:50] The Indie Rock Movement and Its Impact[20:30] Building Community Through Music[31:11] B2B Marketing Takeaways from 90s Indie Rock[38:39] How You Can Be More Authentic in Your Marketing[46:55] Advice for marketing leaders[47:29] Final Thoughts and TakeawaysLinksConnect with Scott on ...
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    48 m
  • Martha: B2B Marketing Lessons on Owning Your Narrative with CMO at CHEQ, Amy Holtzman

    Martha: B2B Marketing Lessons on Owning Your Narrative with CMO at CHEQ, Amy Holtzman
    Apr 15 2025
    At 83 years old, Martha Stewart is still as relevant as ever, and she just released a new documentary to prove it. Martha takes us through the highs, lows, and reinventions of her iconic career.In this episode, we’re diving into the world of Martha and the power of documentaries with our special guest, Amy Holtzman, Chief Marketing Officer at CHEQ. Together, we’re exploring what B2B marketers can learn from bringing documentary-style storytelling into their marketing and the legacy Martha Stewart built. We’re talking about how to build an authentic brand, own your unique style, and stay top of mind for decades.Because let’s be real: who wouldn’t want their brand to have Martha Stewart-level resilience?About our guest, Amy HoltzmanAmy Holtzman is Chief Marketing Officer at CHEQ. Amy brings 20 years of marketing experience to CHEQ, including tenure as CMO and head of marketing at Spring Health, AlphaSense, and Splash. She is also a founding member of Chief, a private network that connects and supports female leaders, and co-founder of NYC-based Women in Revenue Marketing. What B2B Companies Can Learn From Martha:Resilience builds a legacy.
Martha Stewart’s documentary doesn’t shy away from the tough moments, and that’s part of what makes her story so powerful. In business, as in life, setbacks are inevitable. Amy Holtzman puts it simply: “You gotta show up the next day… roll with the punches and figure out how you get through it.” Resilience and conviction aren’t just admirable traits, they’re essential for building a brand that lasts for decades.Own your style.
Martha’s perfectionism is part of her brand. She’s unapologetically herself, and it’s helped her stand out for decades. Amy encourages marketers to take a page from that approach. She explains, “ Martha's an unapologetic perfectionist… Martha owns it, and it's what made her successful. And I think you have to not necessarily own Martha's style, but you have to own your own style.” In B2B marketing, embracing your quirks and leaning into what makes you different is more powerful than playing it safe.Build trust through authenticity.
Martha’s documentary reminds us that connection comes from honesty. Her brand works because it’s consistent and deeply personal. Amy says the same holds true in marketing, “As humans, we crave connection…I  think people shy away from it and B2B a lot of times because they're worried… I think that's what we want. And we can also kind of sniff bulls*** a mile away.” Don’t hide behind jargon or trends. The more human your brand feels, the more trust you’ll build.Quotes*“  You're gonna get knocked down…But you gotta show up the next day. You have to kind of do it all in stride. If you wanna make it right and make a name for yourself and for your business, you have to just like roll with the punches and figure out how you get through it.”*“ You gotta own what makes you special and unique, right? Martha's an unapologetic perfectionist. She insists on things being her way. A lot of times like women can get negative feedback about that and Martha owns it, and it's what made her successful. And I think you have to not necessarily own Martha's style, but you have to own your own style. It's hard to change. You can adapt in certain situations, but you're not gonna change who you are. And I do think you've gotta own it. You gotta own your own unique style. And sometimes that's not what everybody loves, but it's also what makes you and also your brand special and unique.”*“ I feel like as humans we crave connection and look for commonalities, right? And I think people shy away from it, and B2B a lot of times, because they're worried. What if somebody doesn't like that thing or doesn't have the same values that I have? We need to think about what those things are that we share, but also, there's room to be ourselves and be authentic, like Martha, a bit more too. Because, as humans, I think that's what we want, right? And we can also kind of sniff bullsh** a mile away, right? When somebody's not who they say they are. So I think there's room for a bit more.”*“ I know we're probably all sick of like everything AI, but I actually think it's incredibly important to stay really up to speed and think about it beyond productivity.”Time Stamps[0:55] Amy Holtzman, Chief Marketing Officer at CHEQ[02:07] Why Martha, the Martha Stewart Documentary[02:40] The Role of CMO at CHEQ[05:09] Breaking Down Martha[14:22] B2B Marketing Takeaways from Martha[19:57] The Importance of Authentic Storytelling[25:27] Why You Should Be Documenting Brand Moments[32:36] CHEQ's Marketing Strategy[36:14] The Power in Reinventing and Not Replicating[42:22] The Future of AI in MarketingLinksConnect with Amy on LinkedInLearn more about CHEQAbout Remarkable!Remarkable! is created by the team at Caspian Studios, the premier B2B Podcast-as-a-Service company. Caspian ...
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    44 m
  • Taskmaster: B2B Marketing Lessons on Embracing the Unexpected with Head of Brand at Descript, Vanessa Hope Schneider

    Taskmaster: B2B Marketing Lessons on Embracing the Unexpected with Head of Brand at Descript, Vanessa Hope Schneider
    Apr 1 2025
    Playing it safe doesn’t cut it anymore. If you want to grab eyeballs, you need to be bold, unexpected, maybe even a little chaotic.That’s the magic of Taskmaster, a competition show where thinking sideways often beats playing it straight. And in this episode, we’re taking a page from its playbook with the help of our special guest, Vanessa Hope Schneider, Head of Brand at Descript.Together, we explore what B2B marketers can learn from chaos, creativity, and knowing when to follow the rules (and when to completely ignore them).About our guest, Vanessa Hope SchneiderVanessa Hope Schneider is Head of Brand at Descript. There, she leads brand, content, product marketing and community. Her focus is growing the community of creators and communicators using Descript to make videos and podcasts. She’s working to drive engagement and success through feature announcements and community education, and is developing campaigns that illustrate Descript’s perspective on creative work, and the role AI should have in it.Vanessa has previously served as Director of Host Community at Airbnb, Head of Marketing at Clara Labs, and VP of Marketing at One Medical.What B2B Companies Can Learn From Taskmaster:Think laterally. Lateral thinking is about solving problems creatively rather than relying on the most direct or traditional approach. Vanessa encourages marketers to lean into that mindset: “Sometimes your goal is most efficiently achieved by just doing the best practice... but other times you need to break out in your approach.” In B2B marketing, that might mean reimagining how you run events, pitch your product, or tell a story. It’s not about copying what others are doing, but finding the unexpected angle. Like in Taskmaster, the real wins often come from knowing when to be efficient and direct, and when to be bold, playful, or completely off-script.Know when you're the picture and when you're the frame. Sometimes your brand should be the star of the show. Other times, you should be supporting someone else’s spotlight moment. Vanessa explains, “It doesn’t always have to be your brand. It shouldn't always be your brand. Sometimes it's the voices of your customers. It's their success stories.” In the same way, Taskmaster contestants might earn points by hyping up the host, marketers should recognize when to uplift others for the bigger win.Develop your signature style. In Taskmaster, contestants approach identical tasks in wildly different ways, and that's the fun of it. Over time, you start to recognize their unique flair. The same is true for brands. Vanessa says, “It is valuable and compelling to find your style and stick to it, and then approach each new challenge from that perspective.” A strong, consistent style becomes part of your brand identity and how your audience remembers you.Quotes*“ One of the keys to success on Taskmaster and when making content is committing to the bit. If you're self-conscious, if you're mugging for the camera, if you're trying to do too many things at once, if you're distracted, the audience isn't gonna go there with you. Your readership isn't gonna go there with you, your customers aren't gonna go there with you. You have to summon the will, the courage, the focus to go all in, and that's when exciting things are gonna happen. And you might be able to find different types of creativity because you're blocking all that other distraction out.”*” B2B marketers should enjoy lateral thinking. So, sometimes your goal is most efficiently achieved by just doing the best practice, doing it well, and task faster. That would be reading the task and just doing what the task tells you to do. But other times, you need to break out in your approach. You need to be more iconoclastic or more unexpected. You're not gonna win Taskmaster or marketing if you're only doing one or the other. You have to know when to be literal and direct and when to think in new directions. Sometimes you're gonna get the most points if you just speed run the task, but other times you're gonna get points for creativity.”*“ There are instances when you are, as a contestant on Taskmaster, absolutely the star of the show, and you wanna be boisterous and you wanna be attention-grabbing. And of course, we as marketers all can think of instances where we wanna do that with our brand, but in other instances. You kind of wanna be a supporting character. So in Taskmaster, sometimes the best thing to do is make it about Greg because he's a taskmaster and he is very ego-driven…And so the analog for marketers would be. Who are you uplifting in your work? It doesn't always have to be your brand. It shouldn't always be your brand. Sometimes it's the voices of your customers. It's their success stories, so find opportunities to do both.”*“ Your style is your brand…It is valuable and compelling to find your style and stick to it, and then approach each new challenge from that perspective...
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    51 m
  • Simon Sinek: B2B Marketing Lessons on Starting with Why with VP of Marketing at Abridge, Guru Sundar

    Simon Sinek: B2B Marketing Lessons on Starting with Why with VP of Marketing at Abridge, Guru Sundar
    Mar 20 2025
    Simon Sinek says that a lot of organizations can talk about what they do and how they do it. But he says, “Very few organizations know why they do what they do.” And it’s the ‘why’ that is the most important. In this episode, we’re taking this lesson and more from Simon Sinek with the help of our special guest, Guru Sundar.Together, we talk about finding your ‘why’, looking for inspiration in unexpected places, and timing your content so it feels fresh. About our guest, Guru SundarGuru Sundar is VP of Marketing at Abridge, a leader in generative AI for healthcare. Guru has been with the company since September 2023. He previously served as VP of Marketing at Looking Glass Factory and Butterfly Network. Guru holds a BS in Electrical and Computer Engineering from Cornell University and an MSc in Biomedical Engineering at the University of Southern California.What B2B Companies Can Learn From Simon Sinek:Find your ‘why’. Figure out the reason your work is important and use that in your content. Guru says, ”Every company should have a ‘why’ that's rooted in a large problem. And it may be broken into a subset of problems that you tackle over time, but like really focus on that ‘why.’”Look for inspiration in unusual places. Inspiration for your content can come from unexpected places. Guru says, ”Drawing inspiration from outside is culturally ingrained in how we do what we do at Abridge, because if you look at who's next to you, you're not going to innovate. But if you look way far out and break down like, ‘Oh, that brand or that person is having similar challenges, but they're making t-shirts, but I can draw some inspiration from them,’ or like ‘That person over there is making music, or they're making some form of art that no one's ever seen before.’”Time your delivery so content stays fresh. Finesse is everything when delivering content to your audience. Guru says, ”No one likes fatigue. And so you have to keep fatigue, freshness, innovation in mind as you're generating these pieces of content. You could have like four or five different content streams. And people need to hear things multiple times, but they don't need to hear it seven times in a row. A lot of the content is developing the right things for your audience that are innately interesting. If you just ask someone, ‘Hey, is this interesting? Is this useful?’ They say yes. But then serving it at the right frequency, at the right time, in the right form factor and package, is what I think differentiates okay marketers from incredible marketers.”Quotes*”Drawing inspiration from outside is culturally ingrained in how we do what we do at Abridge, because if you look at who's next to you, you're not going to innovate. But if you look way far out and break down like, ‘Oh, that brand or that person is having similar challenges, but they're making t-shirts, but I can draw some inspiration from them,’ or like ‘That person over there is making music, or they're making some form of art that no one's ever seen before.’”*”Every company should have a ‘why’ that's rooted in a large problem. And it may be broken into a subset of problems that you tackle over time, but like really focus on that ‘why.’”*”You can break marketing down into two mainstreams. It's like amazing content that resonates with your audience, you know, your buyer, your end user, and then you have to serve it on all the right channels with the right frequency, usage, et cetera, like cut it up the right way. But content is everything. So it's like, what is it that's going to inspire your buyers? What is it that's going to inspire your end users? And it's keeping it provocative.”*”No one likes fatigue. And so you have to keep fatigue, freshness, innovation in mind as you're generating these pieces of content. You could have like four or five different content streams. And people need to hear things multiple times, but they don't need to hear it seven times in a row. A lot of the content is developing the right things for your audience that are innately interesting. If you just ask someone, ‘Hey, is this interesting? Is this useful?’ They say yes. But then serving it at the right frequency, at the right time, in the right form factor and package, is what I think differentiates okay marketers from incredible marketers.”*”If I was to give advice to others, like, really understand your personas, and make sure you know what they need and do it in the most authentic way. If you don't believe in the content, don't serve the content. And I think a lot of people in marketing just check the box. ‘We need to do emails. We need to do ads. We need to do a white paper,’ but like, why are you doing it? And then assess like, ‘Did this work? Did this not work?’ And use that as impetus to drive the next thing. But you have to really believe in your content. And I think a lot of people are very tactical and ...
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    52 m
  • Intangible.ai: B2B Marketing Lessons on Making AI Your Workhorse to Make Rich, Interactive 3D Content with Co-Founders Charles Migos & Bharat Vasan

    Intangible.ai: B2B Marketing Lessons on Making AI Your Workhorse to Make Rich, Interactive 3D Content with Co-Founders Charles Migos & Bharat Vasan
    Mar 13 2025
    AI is changing so much about how we create content. So we thought we’d bring in the founders of a brand new tool for making rich, interactive 3D content using AI.We’re talking with Co-Founders Charles Migos and Bharat Vasan.And together, we talk about how to make the most out of AI tools, including mocking up ideas, iterating quickly and taking risks.About our guests, Charles Migos and Bharat VasanCharles Migos is Co-Founder & CEO at Intangible. He has over 30 years of experience in the tech industry, specializing in UX and product design. He has previously worked for Microsoft and Apple. Prior to Intangible, Charles served as VP of Product Design at Unity Technologies, where he established a core design practice, principles and philosophy. He also founded a centralized design organization and drove double-digit NPS, CSAT, engagement KPIs and revenue improvement across their portfolio with product design efforts.Bharat Vasan is an experienced investor, executive and board member with 15+ years of leadership in technology. He has a strong track record as a founder and operator in multiple sectors:• Connected Sensors & Devices• Consumer Software and Media• Healthcare, Fitness & Wellness• IoT Sensors / Smart HomeBharat is currently a founder of Intangible.ai, which uses AI to build the world's simplest 3D storytelling tool for creators in games, film, web and XR.Prior to Intangible, Bharat was an investment partner at The Production Board, a $450M venture capital fund, where he built on his experience as an angel investor with a deep network of founders. He helped invest in and create value at businesses ranging from foundry/seed, all the way to growth/IPO. As COO for fund, he also helped the firm fundraise and navigate market cycles in 3 of the most volatile years in venture capital.Bharat also has a strong track record as a P&L operator for growth and early-stage companies, having led his businesses through multiple rounds of financing and acquisitions. Bharat has raised over $500m for his companies, with multiple exits (founded BASIS Science, acq. by Intel; President August Home, acq. by Assa Abloy; CEO of PAX Labs, achieved unicorn status).Bharat is an active public speaker and Board member for venture-backed startups, and nonprofits.What B2B Companies Can Learn From Intangible.ai:Mock up ideas. You can make effective prototypes of a content idea with AI. It lets you get your idea across without having to invest a lot of time or money in a first draft. Charles says, “A storyboard is probably the most important artifact in the process after the script itself. Why? Because it is very low fidelity, but there is very high bandwidth in what it communicates. So like, I as the cinematographer, the director, the set designer, the costume designer, the visual effects supervisor, whomever, looks at A 2D sketch and understands exactly what it means for them creatively. So that idea that you can work from very low or coarse levels of detail, but get to very high levels of detail over time in the way that the process requires is super important. And is as enabling for those film creators or game creators as it will be for these other use cases we hope to activate around live event and architecture, urban design, live event productions and theater and all of that good stuff.”Iterate quickly. Something not quite right with the first version? Iterate quickly using AI. It can even give you multiple drafts or versions of the same idea. Bharat says, ” If you're trying to do a Pixar movie or a documentary, or you're trying to make an interactive game, that's the stuff that feels harder. And it feels like AI can simplify some of that. I can give you a first draft, I can give you a second draft, and I can do it in real time.” Take risks. Because you’re not having to spend too much time or money mocking up your ideas with AI, it allows you to take some risks. Get really wild and see how far your ideas can take you. Bharat says, ”One thing that's happened to businesses because budgets have gotten so big, everyone's super risk averse, so you get more lookalike content. And one reason you don't see great content on channels like we used to, or the box offices, because, you know, when your budget is that large, you can't afford to take a lot of creative risks. So one reason we started the company where we are is if we can make that beginning process easy, if it's easier for Netflix to review more pitches, if it's easier for them to get a better scent, maybe they start taking more diverse bets.”Quotes*” When we found ourselves in this moment around generative AI, I knew that the time had come. Like we could apply generative AI in a way that was designed for creatives to do their best work ever. And I'm an ardent believer that creativity is a team sport.” - Charles Migos*” There's a lot of anxiety about, is AI gonna take over jobs? What is it gonna do to the creative industry? I see it ...
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    53 m
  • Desert Oracle: B2B Marketing Lessons from Ken Layne’s Love of Lo-Fi Media with Chief Evangelist at Contentful, Nicole France

    Desert Oracle: B2B Marketing Lessons from Ken Layne’s Love of Lo-Fi Media with Chief Evangelist at Contentful, Nicole France
    Feb 18 2025
    You would never send a postcard instead of an email, create a zine instead of a white paper, or take polaroids instead of digital headshots. But that’s why you, the digital marketer, should do it.There’s an appeal to all of these lo-fi, analog mediums that call back to yesteryear. A nostalgia. A deliberate denial of modernity. Not only would it surprise your audience, it would lure them right in.So in this episode, we’re making a case for lo-fi content. We’re doing so by pulling marketing lessons from Ken Layne’s Desert Oracle.With the help of our special guest, Chief Evangelist at Contentful, Nicole France, we talk about creating lo-fi content, bucking convention, taking a distinct perspective, and much more.About our guest, Nicole FranceNicole France is Chief Evangelist at Contentful. Nicole is a passionate customer advocate evangelizing new ways of thinking about content and organizing the work of digital business. It’s the wave of the future — and her mission is to make sure everyone knows why. She brings the perspective and critical thinking of an industry analyst and the first-hand experience of a practitioner. Before joining Contentful, Nicole worked as an analyst at Constellation Research and Gartner. She also held a variety of strategy and marketing roles at Fujitsu, Equinix, ITSMA, and Cisco. A graduate of UC Berkeley, Nicole enjoys the outdoors, flying small planes, and embarking on yet another house project in her spare time.What B2B Companies Can Learn From Desert Oracle:Create lo-fi content. Make a zine, a radio show or podcast, a book or comic book. Something your audience can touch and can use to get a bit deeper into your world. Make your brand real for them. Nicole says that when it comes to Desert Oracle, “There's something here that kind of harkens back to what the arts and crafts movement was. In the industrial revolution, you know, this idea of kind of going back to this craft, this artisanal, this very human, this very lo-fi way of doing things. And ironically enough, I think there's a real space for that, even in these digital channels.”Buck convention. Feeling disillusioned with the mainstream take on building an audience? Ken Layne grows his audience by creating niche, tangible content with a strong sense of place and it has garnered a dedicated following. In 2024, 44% of Spotify listeners were new to the Desert Oracle podcast, and it ranked among the top 5 or top 10 podcasts for 5,000 listeners. Nicole says, “ [Ken Layne] is actively rejecting conventional wisdom about how you build an audience. And yet that is absolutely part of what is making him successful at doing it. And it's almost like the extent to which I think of Patagonia a lot of times in this kind of context, where Patagonia is telling you, like, use the stuff you already have. And that somehow is part of what makes you want to keep going back to Patagonia. This is what makes people so loyal to Patagonia is the bigger mission. And like weirdly telling people not to buy it somehow is what makes them want to go and buy more, which is sort of, but not actually their intent.”Take a distinct perspective. What is the story that is unique to you? That’s the story you want to tell. Nicole says, “ That distinctiveness in that perspective and that point of view, I think that's something that really effective brands gravitate toward anyway. They're good at it consciously and sometimes unconsciously as well. And I think B2B marketing needs more of that. You know, where what we offer our customers, regardless of what we're selling is typically not generic stuff. So why should our marketing sound like generic stuff? And yet a whole hell of a lot of it does. For a long time, we’ve been in a world where there's a tremendous volume of noise and the kinds of things that get cut through are things like Ken Layne's curmudgeonly, somewhat dismissive and yet somehow totally compelling take on the world. That’s what draws people in."Curate an experience. Ken Layne curates an experience that captures the mystical nature of Joshua Tree and the greater Mojave Desert. And he does it by appealing to the senses - more than just the sight that digital content requires. You hear the voices of the desert through his podcast and radio show. You can hold an artifact of the desert: the Desert Oracle zine. His multimedia approach creates a world unique to Desert Oracle. And you get the inside scoop. Nicole says, “ There is a very specific point of view, it is Ken Layne's point of view. But he also brings in a bunch of stories from other people and from other places and sometimes from other times as well.  he's curating an experience for you. And I think that is a really powerful takeaway here.”Quotes*” What Ken Layne does with Desert Oracle is paint this very compelling picture of a place. In some cases, a literal place, like when he's hiking out in Joshua tree, or in some cases, it's more of almost ...
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    50 m
  • A River Runs Through It: B2B Marketing Lessons from Fly Fishing with Simpro CMO Rachel Truair

    A River Runs Through It: B2B Marketing Lessons from Fly Fishing with Simpro CMO Rachel Truair
    Feb 11 2025
    A fly fisherman goes to part of the river where the trout are feeding, uses a fly that mimics the insect hatching at that time, and times their cast to land just-so.A marketer goes where their target audience is, posts content in-sync with what’s trending, and times their campaign to land just-so. It’s that same idea of tuning into the media landscape and knowing your audience that will land you the big fish. There are so many marketing lessons we can take from fly fishing. And in this episode, we’re tying the two together through an analysis of A River Runs Through It.With the help of our special guest, CMO Simpro Rachel Truair, we’re talking about how rhythm and timing are everything, going where you’re most likely to find success, and much more.About our guest, Rachel TruairRachel Truair is a seasoned marketing leader with over 15 years of experience in driving revenue and growth for high-growth startups and Fortune 100 enterprises. She combines foundational best practices from her corporate background with agile and innovative approaches from her scale up experience, leading and mentoring teams through successful exits in IPOs and acquisitions. Her teams have won the Forrester Return on Integration Award, the Oracle "Markie" Award, and nominated for the 6Sense Breakthrough Award.Currently, as the CMO of Simpro, a $120M+ ARR private equity-backed field service management software company headquartered in Brisbane, Australia, Rachel is responsible for aligning marketing strategy to business outcomes and creating predictable, scalable sources of revenue. She leverages her expertise in go to market strategy, account based marketing and leading global marketing teams to source pipeline driving ninety percent of Simpro's annual revenue.As an equestrian and fly fisherwoman, Rachel is passionate about conservation and the outdoors, serving on the non-profit board of the Fabien Cousteau Ocean Learning Center. She is a mom of two and holds a BA from St. Edward's University and an MBA from The University of Texas at Austin's McCombs School of Business.What B2B Companies Can Learn From A River Runs Through It:Rhythm and timing are everything. Marketing, like fishing, takes practice, skill and finesse. Rachel says when it comes to flyfishing, “ It's not about strength. It's not about muscling it into something. It's about understanding the rhythm and the timing. A lot of times you want to just try to get to the end and be really perfect at something and put all of your strength into it and throw it as far as you can. But the reality is that actually makes it worse. It makes it harder. And if you can start to learn the rhythm, the feel, the timing of it, you can really start to see improvement.” Go where you’re most likely to have success. In other words, go where your target audience is. Whether that’s social media, email, podcasts, or wherever. You’re literally fishing for customers. Rachel says, ” You really need to focus on the areas where you have the highest probability for success and be testing and iterating within those areas. But you also have to believe that the fish are there, right? You have to know that this is the right area where they would be.  And you can't waste time on the areas where you don't have belief.”It’s all about storytelling. We all know about big fish stories. With fishing, just like marketing, it’s all about having a story to tell. Ian says, “It is about the thing that you can go tell other people and when you get to come back. Whether it's from an event or your podcast series, and you get to go back and everyone says, ‘What'd you get?’ You have to have conviction. You go to the place, you try your best. And if you don't get all the leads or opportunities or whatever it is, that you get that story that you can go back and say, ‘Hey, this is why this was worth it. ’” What’s your story? Quotes*”Cost per lead these days really doesn't mean anything. I could spend a dollar on 3,000 spam leads and that doesn't mean that I'm going to get any new sales or great deals out of it. What is hard is to measure the value of what you're spending money on that creates valuable, sustainable growth. And customers who love the product and have success with the product. That's really not just about spending certain money up front to attract those customers, but also following those customers in their journey and understanding. How are you going to make them successful?”*” You really need to focus on the areas where you have the highest probability for success and be testing and iterating within those areas. But you also have to believe that the fish are there, right? You have to know that this is the right area where they would be.  And you can't waste time on the areas where you don't have belief.”*”Marketing [like fishing] is about the story, it is about the thing that you can go tell other people and when you get to come back. ...
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    47 m
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