Minnesota ICE Agent Shooting Panel: An In-Depth Legal and Law Enforcement Discussion

If you want to understand not just the headlines but the gritty realities of law, training, and police accountability, this episode is a must-listen.

Welcome back to Lawyer Talk! In this special panel episode, “Minnesota ICE,” Steve Palmer brings together a powerhouse group of voices to dig deep into the complexities of police use of force, especially when officers are confronted with split-second decisions involving moving vehicles. Joining Steve Palmer at the table are veteran law enforcement officer Eric Delbert, renowned police defense attorney Mark Collins, and civil rights litigator Dave Goldstein—each bringing decades of experience, unique perspectives, and real-world insights to an issue captivating national attention.

The discussion kicks off with reflections on high-profile cases, including the recent Minnesota shooting involving a federal ICE agent and the local Franklin County officer Connor Grubb, whose prosecution highlighted how perspectives can shift based on the facts known to police at the time of a critical incident. The group navigates the legal frameworks that govern use of force, the importance of training, the shifting public attitudes toward police authority, and the ways grand juries and media narratives influence outcomes before all the facts are in.

You will hear candid opinions about grand jury secrecy, the impact of recent protests on police morale and recruitment, and robust debate over qualified immunity for officers and public officials. Throughout the episode, the panel emphasizes the need for thorough investigations, transparency, and legal guidance, all while maintaining a commitment to justice—no matter who is sitting at the defense or the prosecution table.

Pull up a seat and join the conversation as Lawyer Talk takes you beyond the soundbites and into the heart of the issues shaping law enforcement and civil rights today.

Top 3 takeaways for fellow legal professionals, law enforcement, and anyone passionate about justice:

1. Officers’ Use of Force is Complex: The legal standard for police use of deadly force is built around the reasonable officer standard—not civilian self-defense. It’s shaped by landmark cases like Graham v. Connor, demanding juries step into an officer’s shoes, considering split-second perceptions and training, not just “what would you do?”
2. Obey Now, Challenge Later: The panel reinforced—no matter how tense or unjust a police interaction may feel—comply in the moment, challenge in court. Civil rights and justice are far better protected and remedied after the fact, rather than escalating roadside confrontations.
3. The Need for Clarity & Transparency: Ohio (and the nation) desperately needs clearer jury instructions and legal guidance in police shooting cases. As Mark Collins pointed out, inconsistency across courts and shifting grand jury protocols put officers, victims, and the justice process on unsteady ground. Transparent, thorough investigations and communication with the public can help restore trust.

Moments

00:00 Commitment to Truth and Accountability

08:48 "Officer's Response to Threat"

13:29 Reasonable Officer Perspective Explained

20:14 "Compliance with Police Orders"

23:39 "Comply Now, Address Later"

26:36 Police Recruitment and Accountability Challenges

36:20 Polarized Reactions to Minnesota Case

41:23 Body Cam Perspective Sparks Debate

50:33 "Unexplained Noise in Basement"

56:26 Assessing Threats and Justification

01:02:12 "Justice, Pressure, and Settlements"

01:06:29 "1890 Case: Federal Immunity Standard"

01:12:25...