Jeremy Fishel: Nature's Best Manipulator, Man's Best Controller: Hands | Turn the Lens Ep50

Jeremy Fishel, Principal Scientist at Sanctuary AI, explores why human hands remain robotics' greatest challenge and most important breakthrough opportunity.

With nearly two decades of research in tactile sensing, dexterity, and manipulation, Jeremy brings unique insights into why replicating the human hand is exponentially harder than achieving robot vision or locomotion. He discusses a surprising control paradox: humans struggle to master simple machines like excavators (4 degrees of freedom) yet effortlessly control the complexity of our hands and arms (50+ degrees of freedom). The answer lies in millions of years of evolutionary optimization—and this creates a unique opportunity for robotics.

In this conversation, Jeremy explains:

• Why tactile sensing involves more complex physics than vision—it's active interaction, not passive observation

• The multiple sensing modalities in hands: force, texture, slip detection, thermal sensing, contact geometry

• Why manipulation is fundamentally about slipping and sliding, not static grasping

• The durability paradox: creating soft, compliant surfaces that survive years of real-world use

• Why Sanctuary AI chose hydraulic actuation for their dexterous hands

• How teleoperation allows robots to learn human manipulation intelligence without evolutionary timescales

• The three reasons people cite for human-like hands (and which one actually matters most)

• Sanctuary AI's upcoming next-generation dexterous hand announcement

Recorded at Humanoids Summit 2025, December 11-12, at the Computer History Museum in Mountain View, California. This interview is part of our ongoing collaboration with Humanoids Summit, organized by ALM Ventures.

Jeremy previously founded Tangible Research (acquired by Sanctuary AI in 2023) and co-founded SynTouch, developing the groundbreaking BioTac tactile sensor. His research has been cited over 2,000 times and includes pioneering work on Bayesian exploration for tactile object identification.

Host: Jeff Frick Production: Turn the Lens / Work 20XX Event Partner: Humanoids Summit, ALM Ventures

Show Notes, References, Links and resources: https://www.turnthelenspodcast.com/episodes

YouTube - https://youtu.be/vpk-QgPO6X4